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2+2macht4 01-04-2011 08:52 AM

UPDATED- Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
UPDATED page 8

Let me start by saying this will be long winded but I want to give the thorough info, also I am seeking out help so please do not attack me for the methods used so farm thanks.

I am having a multitude of feeding issues with my 13 day old son and these started at birth. I have tried since birth to breast feed him the past few days I have pretty much given up but it breaks my heart and I want to tray again I am hoping you can help me. As of now I was told to pump every 4 hours and suppliment by mixing in a special hypoallergenic formula that mimics breast milk (and costs close to 20 dollars a small box).

The main issue is latch and supply. I was told my nipples are inverted and given contact sheilds. Now he will latch on occasionally yesterday he even did both sides, but 9 times out of 10 he shakes his head back and forth violently or latches and drops over and over again. He then gets frustrated and turns red and arches his back and screams until we give him a bottle. When he does latch on he is not getting more then 30 grams (we had to weight him before and after meals).

At first they told me to just let him go hungry in the hospital, but then his birth rate dropped too much so they said we had to give him formula and work on increasing my supply by pumping. We did so but i still had issues getting him to latch.

Once home the midwife said to stop the pumping and just breast feed him and if needed to top up with formula, but he would not latch he just got upset. So she said to do a few days of just pumping and feeding. We did that, and at the last visit she said I am not producing enough anyway so we will have to give him formula no matter what.

In regards to pumping the left breast flows well, but the right is engorged and half the time will not even express.

At the final visit with the midwife she said pretty much to pump 4 times a day and once at night or skip at night and to supplement with formula every meal. She pretty much said to give up on ever getting him on the breast.

I am not in an area with LLL, so I do not know where to turn. I really want this to work for us, and ideally get him more breast milk at least even if it has to be in bottle form. But I really want him to drink from the breast and I don't know what to do when everyone tells me to just give up. :cry:

2+2macht4 01-04-2011 08:57 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
Also any advice for the right breast would be great it will not express at all today and really hurts. I tried putting a cold soother on it and it helped only a bit.

tamarag 01-04-2011 09:04 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
:bighug: mama! Dont give up! You can do this. I suggest you get a SNS (supplemtental Nursing System) that way he is getting immediate gratification from the SNS while stimulating your supply at the same time. It doesn't matter what you put in the SNS. It can be formula or BM.
He is more than likely arching, screaming and pulling off because he is frustrated that the milk isn't flowing fast enough like it does from a bottle. Babies are lazy and like immediate gratification! :giggle2:
THe bottle hangs around your neck like a necklace and you can adjust the flow by moving it up and down.

Also I would make sure you are getting lots of fluids and try eating oatmeal. They also have mothers milk tea to help increase your supply. Also fenugreek will help to boost your supply as well. You will smell like maple syrup though. :giggle2:

I am pretty sure that you can use the sns with the nipple shield.

Lots of skin to skin contact will also help boost your supply and get DS wanting to nurse. Strip him down to his diaper and put him up next to your bare chest.

I would also pump more frequently than every 4 hours. I would go at least every night I would go every 4.

Good luck mama and keep us posted!
Your doing a great job!!!!

tamarag 01-04-2011 09:07 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(

Originally Posted by Serenajean1 (Post 11961416)
Also any advice for the right breast would be great it will not express at all today and really hurts. I tried putting a cold soother on it and it helped only a bit.

When you pump the right is nothing coming out?
Great information on engorgement. :goodvibes:

Lanasmom 01-04-2011 09:10 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
First, let me start by saying I am not an expert by any means, but I will tell you what "I" would do in your given situation. There may be some other ladies on here who can chime in with different advice.

It seems to me you have 2 different issues: latch and supply.

I would start with supply. I would take Fenugreek and Blessed Thistle (3 of each 3 times a day) and possibly drink mothers milk tea. I also think that pumping only 4 times a day is too little to tell your body to make more milk. Try pumping every 2-3 hours during the day and possibly taking a 4 hour break at night. As far as getting your right side to let down, I find it helps if you roll your nips b/w your thumb and forefinger before you put the horns on, it seems to stimulate letdown.

For the latch, I would continue using the nip shield, but I would also get a SNS- supplemental nursing system (I think you can make one). I would try not to let the baby get too hungry, and put him to the breast as often as possible when he isn't very hungry so that he will try to latch. With the SNS your body is getting the stimulation it needs to make milk and your DS is getting the milk so not getting too frustrated.

That is all I have, if I think of anything else I will post back. Also do lots of skin to skin with him. I know its frustrating, but you're doing great mama!

Lanasmom 01-04-2011 09:12 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
Blessed Thistle is what really helped me with letdown for the pump...that is why I reccommended it!

youngmomma 01-04-2011 09:14 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
((HUGS)) MOMMA!!! I am sorry you have to go through this without any help close by. I used the nipple shields with my ds and it helped him a may need a different size. DS would only latch on a specific size. Also in the beginning I would trickle some already pumped bm on my nipple to get him to realize what was coming.

The Fancy Pansy 01-04-2011 09:17 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
How to make your own sns. :)


ellaluthien 01-04-2011 09:26 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
For the engorgement it also really helps if you get some washclothes that are wet with really really (like as hot as you can possibly stand) hot water and then lay them on your breast till they start to cool before you pump, do a couple each time it really helps your milk let down. I had to do that with 1st LO and it really helped and was pain relieving as well. Also, I hope I don't offend anyone by suggesting this but, my midwife would also suggest drinking a dark imported beer such as guinness to immediately increase your milk supply. The hops in a dark beer like that help increase your milk supply and believe it or not dark imported beers like that usually have some nutrition to them as well.

mommaagain 01-04-2011 09:37 AM

Re: Please help my baby wont breast feed and midwife says to give up :(
Oh, I'm so sorry your are having a hard time. Breastfeeding should be enjoyable. It can be heartbreaking when things go so wrong. I'll pass along all the knowledge I have learned in 10 yrs as an OB/Nursery/L&D RN and LC (not IBCLC). Rally your supporters and be committed to giving it another shot.

First, it seems like you are not getting good help or advice. You can breastfeed with inverted nipples. Do they come out with the shield? when you pump? or when stimulated? Then you can likely breastfeed.

First things first. He needs to eat. Major weight loss is concerning, esp. if he was not full term. Ditch the bottles. They are especially confusing for a baby with latching issues. Feed with a dropper, teaspoon, plastic medicine cup, or cup feeder. Doesn't have to be fancy.

Boost your supply. There are many things that can help. I use Mothers Milk tea, but check with a local IBCLC for safety and other things that may help. Lots of mom's here swear oatmeal helps. I haven't tried it myself, but it's definitely safe. Be sure you are keeping up on your fluids.

Up the pumping. 4 times a day is definitely not enough for a full milk supply. Breastfeeding is all about supply and demand. You should be copying baby's feeds, every 2-3 hours, and try for once at night. Your hormones are highest at night, so this is great for your supply. Are you pumping with a hospital grade double electric pump? If you are going to put all this work into pumping, rent the best pump you can find. Do the flanges, or horn shaped parts of the breast pump fit you properly? Nipples are like snowflakes, no two are the same. Properly fitted flanges will make a world of difference in how much milk you get out. Pump at least 10-15 min, 20 is a lot, more than that is overkill. A shield diminishes the contact to the breast, so even if baby nurses with it, pump for a few minutes after to make up for it.

Use warm a warm compress for a few minutes before you pump. You can also put the warm water to your breasts in the shower. Or take a big basin of warm water and bend over and soak the girls for a few minutes. This will help with the let down, get the milk flowing, and help with the engorgement, or the plugged ducts you might have. Also, bend over and do a little massage to the breasts, and stimulate the nipples by hand yourself. Your hubby may be glad to help with this ;) (hey, there has to be some fun in this) Kittens knead when they eat, so do human babies. It's all part of the let down process. he possibly tongue tied? Can he stick his tongue out? Does that little bit of tissue that attaches the tongue to the floor of the mouth come all the way to the tip of the tongue? A tongue tie can be snipped by a qualified MD and WILL help with latching. How does he suck? Does he put his tongue up to the roof of his mouth and push out the nipple? You can do suck training. Wash your hands, clip your finger nails and let him suck on your upside down pinky finger. If he is not sucking properly, he can figure it out on you finger. You will know for sure when he gets a regular, rhythmic suck going. This will cut down on some of the frustration at the breast.

More latching...Try when he's not starved. Try when he's half full, or sleepy. He won't fight it so much. Do the suck training, and then offer the breast. If he won't go, offer with the shield. Work up to taking the shield off part way through the feeding. The nipple should be pulled out at that point and you may be able to pop him right back on the breast.'re probably going to have some for a couple weeks with inverted nipples. They have a lot more stretching to do when a baby nurses than an everted nipple. It will go away (and your nipples will no longer be inverted!) You should not have bruising, blistered, cracked or bleeding nipples. If baby is latching well, he's covering the areola and the nipple ends up in the back of his mouth. Your midwife should have at least shown you that. needs to be done until he's nursing well, or you can get your supply up enough to fully feed breast milk. Nurse first, or give breast milk first, then just enough formula to keep him happy. You can nurse and have someone else supplement while you pump, if you would like. I suggest supplementing at the breast. With my twins, I would latch them on and used a curved tip plastic dropper to supplement them while they ate. As soon as the baby stopped sucking, I would squeeze a couple drops of formula or breast milk into the corner of their mouth. They would suck a bit more and I would repeat. It's far less time consuming to supplement at the breast, AND it provides additional stimulation to the breast, so good for your supply. You could always use a supplemental nurser for the same purpose.

That's all I can think of at the moment. Search for some form of breastfeeding support in your area. Is there a clinic nearby? Or a support group? The medela website has a ton of good information as well as the LLL site. I hope some of this information is helpful. My heart goes out to you. Best of luck.

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