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-   -   Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th (http://www.diaperswappers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1441613)

Love4leon 09-09-2012 07:22 PM

Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
This thread is for women that have children who are trying to have more and struggling with infertility (IF). You fall into the IF category if you have been trying for more than a year or if you have known fertility issues. Some have secondary IF and some have primary IF. Some of us are TTC naturally and some need treatments of some type. All are welcome!

We also have women who are praying to make it. Due to prior losses or IF they don't feel like they should join a due date board till after the first 12 weeks. We are truly happy to support you as you transition. Please just keep in mind that we are a group of woman struggling with IF and be sensitive to that as you post. If you put a pregnancy ticker or smiley in your signature, please turn off your signature when you post in this thread. Thank you!

Please note: When your information needs to be updated, please highlight the area that needs to be updated. This will make it easier for me to update you. :goodvibes:

If you'd like to be added please post your info using the format below. Please note: I remove names if you are inactive for one month. This really helps keep the list more manageable, if you would like to be added back, just repost your info. :D

Women TTC: :ttc: :noaf:

Screen Name (Real Name): 3 Ladybugs (Jennifer)
Age: 35
Current Children and age: 3 lost children (July, August 2006, January 2007),M/C 9/2007, 1 living son 9/2008, M/C and lost frostie 7/2012
Diagnosis: Unexplained infertility to start with, now in menopause due to chemo, also had pelvic radiation that complicates things a bit.
Treatment and meds: Have 3 frozen embryos (my last 5 bits of hope), low dose aspirin, prenatal vitamin with low Vit. E, Estrace (orally and vaginally), progesterone in oil, and Prometrium. Have port cath flushes every 6-8 weeks.
Next Appointment: 9/5 Ultrasound and bloodwork, 9/10 FET, Beta 9/15, Oncologist on 10/17
Cycles TTC another: Got cleared to do my FET back in 11/10 pending oncologist telling my RE I didn't have cancer... turns out I did. So have been waiting since then to get to this point. It took 2 years 7 months for first cycle after cancer, now working on second cycle.

Name: flynnsmom/ Lilo (real name)
Age:30
Current children: 3 year old DS
Losses: I think several very early MCs
Diagnosis: none yet
Next apt: none yet
Cycles TTC: on and off for 3 years as frustration permits. During an 8 yr. marriage have only prevented 6 months

Screen Name (Real Name): School123 (Lizzie)
Age: 35 my Dh is 36
Current Children and age: DD1 11, DS1 age 8, DS2 age 2.5
Lost Children and dates: 9 mc
Diagnosis: secondary infertility, unexplained
Next appointment: None
Cycles TTC another: too long, then decided we were done, then surprise +HPT, then another mc

Screen Name (Real Name): amyltc (Amy)
Age: 28 my Dh is 32
Current Children and age: DD1 Allie, age 6, DD2 Hannah age 4
Lost Children and dates: none
Diagnosis: Endometriosis, surgery to remove 9/14/10, tipped uterus, mostly unexplained infertility, subclinical hypothyroidism Medsthyroid)
Next appointment: None
Cycles TTC another: about 3 years

Screen Name (Real Name): Hope4More (Mel)
Age: 32
Current Children and age: Jake, 20 mos
Diagnosis: PCOS, was told at 14 years old I would never have children, I do not ovualte EVER without intervention
Treatment and meds: Magnesium, turmeric, DCI, Vitex
Next Appointment: Tuesday, August 14th, to discuss my PCOS and regulating my cycles: I plan to bring up met and progesterone cream.
Cycles TTC another: With Jake it took us 9 months (4 cycles).

Screen Name (Real Name): meeshkasheeba (Tina)
Age: 28 (DH 28)
Current Children and age: DS1 5 DS2 3
Lost Children and Dates: 8 Wk Miscarriage Jan, '07
Diagnosis: stage IV endometriosis and PCOS
Treatment and meds: multiple surgeries, Lupron x 6mo started 5/3, metformin, gluten free diet, and a slew of vitamins

Screen Name (Real Name): jacquelinemarie82 (Jacqueline)
Age: 30
Current Children and age: Jasmine, 2 years old (2/10/2010)
Lost Children and Dates: N/A
Diagnosis: male infertility
Treatment and meds: Clomid / IUI cycle #3
Next Appointment: Currently in 2ww
Cycles TTC another:


Screen Name (Real Name): ingrid5699 (Ingrid)
Age (DH): 41 (ME) 37
Current Children and age: Patrick, 5 years, Aurelia 3 years
Lost Children and dates: triplets Nov. 2004, baby B May 2006, latest little angel 2'12
Diagnosis: Me: endometriosis and immunological issues, DH: male factor
Treatment and Meds: fresh IVF #9 done, too many meds to list
Next appointment: retrieval was May 31st, transfer set for June 4th
Cycles TTC another: never prevented, 3 FET failures, 1 fresh cycle failure, one m/c after the 2nd fresh cycle this time around

Screen Name (Real Name): finleyjudemommy (Susan)
Age (DH): 47 (ME) 36
Current Children and age: B/G twins 6 and YDD 4
Lost Children and dates: M/C March 04, M/C June 09, Chemical Feb 10 and stillborn October 10
Next appointment: Need to get my thryoid under control before I can move on...hopeful that will be soon. Hopefully will be able to start Lupron as soon as next cycle starts.
Cycles TTC another: Entirely too many to count

Screen Name (Real Name): love4leon (Rebecca)
Age: 37 (DH 38)
Current Children and age: Winnie 5 years
Diagnosis: Endometriosis (Me) DH diagnosed with Low sperm count, low motility, and liquidation. 5/11 diagnosed with testicular cancer. Finished chemo August 2011
Treatment and meds: IUI done 1/2/2011, 2/5/2011, 3/2011, 4/2011 Clomid days 5-9, trigger shot and IUI on 2/14/2012,IVF starts June- Egg retrieval June 20th
Next Appointment: June 8th
Cycles TTC another: 27 cycles, but well over 2 years (took a break during cancer treatments

Screen Name (Real Name): carlaross (Carla)
Age: 36, DH 39
Current children and ages: Zach 17, Jarrod 16, Griffin 2 (12-28-09)
Diagnosis: DH had vasectomy '99 (previous marriage), reversal 3/09. Immediately (9 days after surgery) and had my LO 12-28-09. Never used birth control, began TTC another immediately after 1st PPAF, 8/10. After 15 cycles, we began a fertility workup and were devastated to find out he has complete scarring of the reversal site and a zero sperm count. :(
Cycles TTC another: since Aug 2010
Next appointment: January 9 (with my ob/gyn to begin my fertility workup and discuss options)


Screen Name (Real Name): slimy72 (Laurel)
Age: 30 Dh 32
Current Children and age: DS 4yo
Lost Children and Dates: 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2011
Diagnosis: Endometriosis, do not ovulate regularly. Dh- MS, Celiacs, Ulcerative colitis, low count, poor morphology and motility, but that is suspected due to current medications, will be re-evaluated once off them. Is now off them and it is partially recovered.
Treatment and meds: Clomid, provera, prometrium, baby aspirin and a host of supplements and vitamins. Laprascope '09, lupron shots '09, trying out acupuncture and chiropractic right now too.
Next Appointment: August 27, first appt with new RE
Cycles TTC another: 4 1/2 yrs for DS, 3 1/2 yrs so far for #2.

Screen Name
(Real Name): sdavis514 (Sarah)
Age: 31 (DH 32)
Current Children and age: one DS age 5
Lost Children and Dates: none
Diagnosis: We were NTNP for 4 years, diagnosed with PCOS in 2003 and put on clomid from 9/04-1/05, no results, took break and became pregnant with DS with no intervention in Aug 2006. Recent blood work suggested no insulin resistance. Clomid again 9/11-1/12. BFNs IUI cycle in April 2012 - BFN and May 2012 - BFN, July 2012 sono-HSG - clear
Treatment and meds: Clomid 100 mg cd 3-9, ovidrel trigger shot and progesterone suppositories ( not sure yet what the protocol will be for next cycle)
Next Appointment: Call when AF shows and start clomid, u/s cd 12 to check follicle sizes
Cycles TTC another: NTNP for 4 years, Actively TTC since Jan 11


Screen Name (Real Name): JCPACandMommy (Carissa)
Age: 31 (DH 35)
Current Children and age: one DS age3.5
Lost Children and Dates: none
Diagnosis: PCOS as of Jan '12 but I am ovulating New said to have Old Ovaries and No PCOS?
Treatment and meds: Femara 5mg once daily CD4-8,Metfomin 500mg 3x dialy, Prenatal Daily, HCG trigger ~CD12 New Treatment this month: Follistim CD 3-8, Estrace CD8-11, Ovadril Trigger CD9, IUI CD11, Endometrin CD 15 till they tell me to stop!

Next Appointment:
May 30 US for Folllie check then Trigger then IUI
Cycles TTC another:
Mirena Out April 5, 2011 was NTNP till Aug, then active TTC since then with No luck we are on Cycle #13


Women Pregnant and praying to make it. :crossfingers: :preggo: :pray: If you need to be added to this list please give your EDD and the date you will be 12 weeks. Thank you! To find out how many weeks you are use this link.

Screen name (Real Name): Melmonkey (Mel)
Age: me - 34, hubby - 35
Children and ages: girl almost 18 months
Losses: none
Diagnosis: unexplained
Treatment: Clomid 50mg cd 3-7
Next Appt: don't have one, hopefully in the next few months we'll be doing OB/Gyn appts again!
Cycles TTC another: AF showed Dec 2010....we have not prevented since then....

Screen Name (Real Name):lalakiwi7 (Liesl - pronounced leesal)
Age (SO): 26 and hubby is 26, Happily married for 6 yrs. Together for 11.
Current Children and age: Noah is our oldest, adopted lil man - 6yrs old. Frances is our first born who just turned 3.
Lost child: early losses 7/2011 & 11/2007
Diagnosis: Stage four endometriosis
Treatment and meds: Just had endo surgery in Jan and finished three rounds of depot lupron. Now waiting for AF. After that Femera 5mg, HCG trigger, and progesterone after O and decadron.
Next Appointment: Will be a follie scan CD 12 once I start AF again.
TTC: Since Francy was a baby.... more than 2.5 years

Screen Name (Real Name): yellowitchgrl (Sarah)
Age: 30 (husband 34)
Current Children and age: Andrew-7, Luke-4
Lost Children and Dates: Zach (15w, 7/09), Toby (12w, 12/09), Simon (14w, 6/11)
Diagnosis: I'm perfectly healthy, so are the babies (except they're dead)
Treatment and meds: Praying and some extra folic acid (my idea, not docs)
Next Appointment: Not bothering.
Cycles TTC another: Not trying, but not preventing either

Screen Name (Real Name): Psylion (Alanna)
Age (DH): 37 (ME) 38
Diagnosis:high FSH and DOR
Treatment and meds: this will be our third injectables cycle with iui, the first two were with letrozole and menopur and this one is just menopur and metformin
Current Children and age: Sequoia is 4 1/2
Lost Children and dates: early MC 2/12
Next appointment: ?
Cycles TTC another: we only prevented a few months since DD was born
EDD: 12/12/12
12 weeks: May 30, 2012[/COLOR]


Screen Name (Real Name): GracieMak'sMama (Sara)
Age: 22 (DH 23)
Current Children and age: one DD age 2(almost)
Diagnosis: Unexplained Infertility
Treatment and meds: Natural diet
Cycles TTC another: Almost a full year.
EDD: Oct 9th
12 weeks: 3/26



:hide: :cheerleader2: Lurkers/Waiting to TTC/Graduates/Cheerleaders :hide: :cheerleader2:

Screen name (Real Name): Fleece Be With You (Jessica)
Age: 24
Children and ages: Hunter, born 9-18-09
Losses: none
Diagnosis: Celiac disease (unconfirmed, but a safe assumption at this point)
Treatment: Very limited version of GAPS diet, digestive enzymes, vitamin supplements
Next Appt: Seeing my chiropractor next week to look into my cortisol/adrenal issues.
Cycles TTC another: We haven't been preventing since Hunter was born.

Screen Name (Real Name): Harmony96 (Andrea)
Age: 33 (DH 31)
Current Children and age: DD (5), DS (29m)
Lost Children and Dates: ^i^ DS 11/27/11-12/24/11
Diagnosis: No official diagnosis, but currently having short luteal phases (6-7 days). Probably is just what my body "does" for its first few postpartum cycles.
Treatment and meds: Prenatal, folic acid, iron, several other supplements. Also trying to eat right and exercise (and hopefully lose about 15 pounds, but none of that has happened yet).
Next Appointment: N/A
Cycles TTC another: Lost baby was a c-section, had VBAC consult in March '12 and was told we could go ahead and try again if we felt ready.

Screen Name (Real Name): Hannah Elise (errr.. Hannah... hehe)
Age: 23, and dh is 22
Diagnosis: non-celiac gluten intolerant, malabsorption of nutrients
Treatment and meds: Gluten-free diet. Supplementing with Metagest (stomach acids and enzymes to improve proper digestion), aloe vera gel, and probiotics. Current Children and age: Asher (aka "Wee Goon"), 12.5 months
Cycles: 12/4/11, 1/12/12, 2/11/12, 3/20/12

Screen Name (Real Name): Vegan Princess (Cindy)
Age (SO):32
Current Children and age: Child 1: 2.5 yrs
Lost Children and dates: Chemical pregnancy (11/10), miscarriage at 9.5 weeks (5/11), possible chemical pregnancy (9/11)
Diagnosis: Diminished ovarian reserve for me. Moderate or severe male factor (depending on who you ask) for DH
Treatment and Meds:Beginning 2nd IUI cycle w/5mg femara, ovidrel trigger and prometrium. Will do this cycle and one more IUI and then meet with doctor to discuss IVF or using donor egg. - Moved to IVF
Next appointment: Follicle scan on 9/ 29. IUI on 10/1 or thereabouts. Will meet with RE to discuss game plan again in November.
Cycles TTC another: Had IUD removed 4/10 but really have been trying since 6/10.


Screen name (Real Name): heatherlovesCD's (Heather)
Age: me - 33, hubby - 38
Children and ages: boy 6, Twins girl/boy 4, Twins boy/boy 22 months.
Losses: March '07
Diagnosis: severe male factor infertility
Treatment: IVF/FET, 1 fresh IVF cycle = 1 boy. FET's = 1 early m/c, 2 sets of twins, 1 BFN
Cycles TTC another: I don't keep track. We have been TTC since 11/10.
Due date: Oct 15th
Date I'll be 12wks: 4/2/12


Screen Name (Real Name): Sillyutalktome (Jeanette)
Age: 30 (DH 29)
Current Children and age: Dd - M - 6/08
Lost Children and Dates: Etopic 7/09 (8 weeks) Possible chemical 6/10
Diagnosis: tubal infertility & male factor
Treatment and meds:1st IVF 10/18/11 BFN, FET planned for January
BFP: 2/7/12
EDD: 10/12/12[/QUOTE]


Screen Name (Real Name): Wordmama (Lucy)
Lost children: 8 early miscarriages, Libi (8 week ectopic, March 2011)
Diagnosis: Damaged right tube for me, poor morphology for DH
Treatment and meds:Prayer, maca, zinc
Cycles TTC another: Over a year
EDD: June 18, 2012


Screen Name (Real Name): Dewberri (joy)
Lost Children and dates: Dec. 2010 (6 wks); June 2011 (Kayle(e), 11wks)
Diagnosis: ANA, nonspecific
Treatment: Aspirin daily, Progesterone till 10 weeks
EDD: June 14, 2012


Screen Name (Real Name):
Liz*RN*BSN (Elizabeth)
Lost Children: 5 early m/c
Diagnosis: PCOS, Recurrent Miscarriage, Factor 5 Leiden Clotting Disorder
Treatment and meds: Lovenox, Baby Aspirin, Metformin, PNV, Endometrin
TTC: Over 1 year

Screen Name (Real Name): Meldo (Melissa)
Losses: 1
Diagnosis: DH has low sperm count/motility. Both of our kids were IVF/ICSI babies.
Cycles TTC another: It's our 8th (and last) IVF cycle.
EDD: May 1, 2012

3 ladybugs 09-10-2012 06:16 AM

Re: Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sdavis514 (Post 15655123)
AFM - CD 1 was yesterday and I called RE but missed them at the office. On call DR called me back and said to call office in the morning. Since she did not have my chart and wasnt my regular DR, she was not sure what he would want to do this cycle. But agreed that he would likely want to move to injectibles. I call the office this morning and talk to my nurse. She says, there is not time to order the injectibles since they would need to start tomorrow. And set up a phone conference with the RE on Tuesday for me.

I am so mad!!! I had to skip last cycle to have a sono-hsg. Told the RE that I definitely wanted to do something the next cycle. He told me that the test was all clear and to call CD 1. I do, expecting them to have the plan ready so we can get the meds, etc but they dont. So I took the stupid Provera for NOTHING!! I hate that stuff and only took it so we could move on to another cycle but now the nurse tells me that the RE is probably gonna want me to lose an additional 10 -15 lbs before we do an injectible cycle. I have been working by but off for months and have lost 15 lbs already but I had really expected to be doing a cycle now. If I had known all this, I would have not taken the provera and waited to get a natural period. Not point in getting AF now if I have to wait anyway.
I spent the whole morning crying and now I have 3 birthday parties to go to today. One at 2, 4 and 7. I am not in the mood at all and just wanna crawl into bed and hide!!!!!

- This would make me fuming too! I can't believe they are doing that to you! I don't see what 10-15 lbs is really going to accomplish for you. It is not like you can get to a certain weight and it is a magic number where you will suddenly get pregnant! :laugh: Yes we all need to be exactly 135.7 pounds before we get pregnant. If we are 135.6 or 135.8 then too bad! :giggle2: I hope you get answers tomorrow!

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCPACandMommy (Post 15657482)
I think I'm CD1.... Lots of bright red today so much so I've had to use tampons so I'd say CD1 but do I stop progesterone? RE hasn't called back yet! I called this AM to tell them I thought it was cd1 and what do I need to do but haven't heard anything..
I thought with progesterone I'd have to stop it to get AF... So I guess I'll continue it till I hear otherwise...

Oh no!!! :banghead::banghead::banghead: I thought for SURE you were going to get pregnant this month!!! How could this happen??? I hope you get answers soon! You definitely deserve that! :hugs: :bighug:

Today is my transfer day so I will let you know what happens. :)

slimy72 09-10-2012 07:20 AM

Re: Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
Good luck Jennifer, I'll be routing for you!

AFM, back to work today. Don't really want to be here, it's going to take a lot of effort to be patient and not let the kids know how I'm feeling. I'm usually pretty good at compartmentalizing when I'm at work, but I konw I'm in for a struggle today. Luckily I had planned for the possibility of a Sub so I have an easy lesson planned. Have to try calling the RE one more time today just to make sure the plan is to wait a month before we do testing. He told me this month (even knowing my test was +) but his nurse is saying no wait a month. And then I still need to know when I'm suppose to have a repeat HCG to see if we're back down to 0 yet.

Love4leon 09-10-2012 08:23 AM

Re: Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
Laurel- I hope the day goes by quick for you at work. Hopefully it is fun and keeps your mind off things for a while.

Jennifer- Hooray!!!! I am so excited for you!! Tell us all about it when you get back! I want details :)

slimy72 09-10-2012 12:42 PM

Re: Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
I told you ladies a while ago that I was going to sew myself new mama cloth. I've had a huge mental block because to me it was like admitting defeat. Well, over the weekend I finally did it. It's not defeat, but it is turning into a much longer journey than I'd been hoping for and so I want to have enough to be comfy. Here's my craft thread to show them off: http://www.diaperswappers.com/forum/....php?t=1441801 It's kind of healing actually to do something that I"ve been putting off for so long.

Love4leon 09-10-2012 02:59 PM

Re: Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by slimy72 (Post 15663117)
I told you ladies a while ago that I was going to sew myself new mama cloth. I've had a huge mental block because to me it was like admitting defeat. Well, over the weekend I finally did it. It's not defeat, but it is turning into a much longer journey than I'd been hoping for and so I want to have enough to be comfy. Here's my craft thread to show them off: http://www.diaperswappers.com/forum/....php?t=1441801 It's kind of healing actually to do something that I"ve been putting off for so long.

Laurel- they look fantastic!!!! I love the swirl dye, but they all look so beautiful- amazing job! So happy to see that they help with the healing process- you must feel so proud. I am very impressed! :)

slimy72 09-10-2012 07:39 PM

Re: Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
It took a lot for me to finally do those and not feel like I was giving up on my body, so yes, I"m pretty darn proud of them. On the medical front, feeling some better physically today, but emotionally today has been a lot of up and down. Had to go for another blood draw today to find out if I can have my CD 3 testing done tomorrow, hcg is at a 6 and they needed it at a 0 to do the testing. So I'm suppose to go in again in a week and see if it is down to 0 yet. So all testing will have to wait until next month now. I just feel so behind. If I had just gone when my dr tried to refer me last year maybe none of this would have happened. I just felt like it worked with my son with just my regular OB so surely it would work again. Maybe my son was the miracle fluke and wasn't suppose to happen. IDK, I just am really feeling down about all of this today and not sure I"m up to taking the next step. It really does help me to know what you guys who are further into the process are going through. Honestly, I'm scared half to death of all these tests they want to run. I just have no clue what to expect.

BTW, Jennifer, where are you? How did the transfer go?

JCPACandMommy 09-10-2012 09:40 PM

Well mamas I had my Ultrasound to check lining and antrafollicles and RE says it looks good also ha an estradiol level drawn but no results from it yet! Upped my Follistem to 100u this time around instead of 75 like last time! FX it works this cycle!
On another note DH and I talked and we are done with IUI for a while and will just do good ol BDing! It was a mutual decision based primarily on cost right now and the fact it really only increases our odds if at all by 10%....
Have repeat follicle check Saturday!

Slimy love the mama cloth!! Hope u can heal emotionally quickly mama!

How did transfer go Jennifer? Thinking about you!

Hope4More 09-11-2012 04:46 AM

Slimy: we've all had that feeling- I hope you heal quickly and the docs get their act together for you soon!

Jennifer- how'd the transfer go?

Melmonkey: been thinking of you lately. Hugs.

Afm: I ovulated within the last two days. I'm excited to get crosshairs to finish off my monitor experiment. We did all we could with dh out of town, so I'll just keep my fingers crossed and see what happens. I'm hopeful, but not overly optimistic considering the dtd schedule Pre-o. We'll see...

3 ladybugs 09-11-2012 06:05 AM

Re: Blessed with children, Struggling for more Week of September 10th
 
slimy72 - Wow you did a GREAT job with those!! I think we know what you should do if you need extra money! I would totally buy some if I needed any. :blush:

You actually are not pregnant if your under 5. So they were really splitting hairs with you! :nono: I am sorry your going through this! After my miscarriage of Baby D (September of 2007). I was at a beta of 25 at my first AF (the baby miscarried at 9 weeks). I was so furious!! :banghead: It took till the next AF a month later for me to FINALLY get under 5. I thought it was REALLY odd as I had a d&c but that was how it was to be. I certainly know what it is like to feel like you have no control over your body and how you feel like your body wants to be pregnant as much as the rest of you! :hugs:

JCPACandMommy - Good luck with your new game plan! It sounds like it should be a winner!

Hope4More - I hope you get your miracle baby this month! You certainly were very prepared to ovulate with all that you did! What were your results? Did you like one method better then the other?

AFM - Sorry I didn't post here. I posted on my thread in the Sensitive subjects board. Here are the compulations of those:
Quote:

I am back. We didn't loose anyone in the thaw :yay: so I still have 2 embryos frozen. Baby J was transferred. This baby I thought would be transferred last time. He/she was even hatching!! Beta test on 9/21. Will post photo on blog tomorrow.

I have a great feeling about the baby!!
Later:
Quote:

Thank you everyone!

This evening a little bit of doubt got into me. What if this wasn't right or that? Then I looked at my photo of the embryo and I wonder if I am going to get identicals. Oh what a crazy ride!! I mentioned the identicals to DH and I don't think he turned that white with the news of the triplets (on ultrasound)! I think everyone around me would be but I would just see it as Gods will.

You will see what I mean about the embryo when I post it tomorrow.
Then this morning:
Quote:

Okay I scanned him or her in! I posted it on my blog if you want to see: http://www.ourunplannedlife.com/2012...and-after.html I included the before the freeze and after the freeze photos.

Can you see now why I wonder if this will become identicals? :nervous:


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