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Old 04-01-2009, 08:34 AM   #11
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

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Anyway, my friend recommended Babywise and when I took them to the Ped at 5 weeks (who is also my family doc) I asked him if he had ever heard of it. He was a strong advocate for it and strongly encouraged me to use it. He also taught a class on it. He said he could tell that I desperately needed sleep. We started Babywise when they were 7 weeks and 4 days old. By 8 weeks, they were sleeping through the night from 10pm to 6am. They had had a habit of waking at 2 and 4:30. They weren't waking out of hunger, but habit. I was very very very learly of this, but heard a lot of praise and finally convinced myself it would be okay. And it was. The first 3 nights they woke up at 2 and 4:20 just like usual. But they cried themselves back to sleep.

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Old 04-01-2009, 08:40 AM   #12
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

Here is a book that I really enjoyed http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0385483627/ref=nosim/chrisficti-20 One of the points in the book that I found especially interesting is that if you leave a baby to CIO, it will raise their levels of cortisone and that prolonged high levels of cortisone in the body can lead to high blood pressure and heart disease later in life. Anyway it's a very interesting read and doesn't only talk about cio, but also co-sleeping and babywearing along with other things. So sorry you are getting pressure to let your lo cio.
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Old 04-01-2009, 08:48 AM   #13
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

Mama,
I'm sorry you are dealing with sleep issues with your baby. I want to tell you what you described about crying in the car and dealing with dirty hands doesn't have one thing to do with sleep training your baby. Whether you babywise, no cry sleep solution, ferber, whatever the method. These do not involve randomly choosing times to ignore your baby. These methods involve mastering daytime sleep first, then nighttime, and include a consistent pattern to putting your children to sleep. I am scheduler here and my children were both taught to sleep in their beds and fall asleep on their own from birth. Neither one has ever had a complaint or a cry about nap or nighttime since 8 weeks. I personally don't agree with night feeding until you're too tired to continue then all of a sudden leaving them to cry in the middle of the night and then continuing to nurse to soothe every issue during the day. I think its wrong to suddenly change the rules and have different protocols during the night and day. This version of CIO is quite cruel to me. However, if your DH's coworkers are indicating that you don't nurse to sleep day and night and that naps and bedtimes are set by the parents and they are finished at the determination of the parents on regular intervals, then that makes sense to me. Sleep taught children do not cry themselves to sleep nor cry to be gotten when they awake (without something being wrong KWIM), but they do sleep deeply and for long periods of time in predicable increments. Hope you and DH find a solution that works for both of you.
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Old 04-01-2009, 09:30 AM   #14
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

I'm so sorry you are having troubles. Things will get better and I believe you should raise your child the way you feel is right and not what others think. We were lucky in that DH co-workers talked about other ways to getting LO to sleep and not the CIO method (it was mentioned, but not advised). Other posters have mentioned the links and such that we read on it.

I think with a lot of LO it happens when they are ready. We had the hardest time with our LO. She always wanted to nurse at night, if we put her down by herself (out cold or not) she was wide wake before she hit the mattress and and woke up every 2 hours. We went to bed one night at 10pm, the next thing I know the alarm said 8am. I did a double take and then panicked as I thought something was wrong with DD. I actually woke HER up making sure she was alright!

Since then, she sleeps through the night. Sometimes she fuses in the middle of the night, anything longer then 5 minutes or if she starts screaming her head off, we go in and check on her. Most of the time though it is just a couple fuses and she is right back to sleep. This all started at 7mos.
So, as I said things will get easier. You do what you feel is right! Mommy knows best right?
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Old 04-01-2009, 10:15 AM   #15
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

I don't have any hard evidence for you but I know this from experience: Some kids have seizures when they are stressed, if they are prone to seizures. I found out by doing seizure research that some adults and children have what they call "stress seizures." This could include stress from "crying it out." (My daughter is prone to seizures after having one associated with a fever and some metabolic concerns so we take extra precautions to prevent all the seizures we can.)

I also read an article at www.phdinparenting.com/2008/07/05/no-cry-it-out that talks about the neurological dangers of the cry it out method. I had already chosen to not do that method when my daughter was newborn because I read in the "What To Expect The First Year" book that babies who are attended to when they cry grow up to be more secure and independant. And I can honestly say that it's working for my daughter. She's almost one year old and already very secure. She sleeps most of the night on her own now in her crib, but only because she "chose" to do so. Believe me, it was a rough year being constantly woken up and having her sleep with me 99% of the time but it was worth it.

But even for those kids that need more support at night, it's not like they end up being 20 and still sleeping with their parents or crying when they don't want to go to bed.
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Old 04-01-2009, 10:21 AM   #16
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

DS #1 hated to be alone (still does at 9yo) - people would always tell me to let him cry it out- it was heartbreaking and didint work- he would scream for hours and be drencehed with sweat- I abandoned it quickly - he coslept until he was 4 when he was ready to sleep on his own- still a cuddler though!

DS #2 - he has slept in own room since 6 months, cries sometimes for about 5 min and falls asleep, other times, smiles and says night night. Sometimes if I cant placate him during the day when he is cranky, I will let him walk around and not pick him up- he just seems to need to cry the crankiness out - usually lasts 3 min and then hes fine.

Anyway- different personalities- I would go with your judgment- you know whats best for your child and will figure out what works!
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Old 04-01-2009, 10:49 AM   #17
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

DH threw a big fit last night and argued that raising DS is a democracy and that he should have some say. I told him flat out, it's my child too and I'm NOT doing it. He went to bed pouting and said that he's no longer helping put him to sleep. Well there's something new

Still, I am finding that he's trying to do it somewhat behind my back. Last night before our argument he was pacing with DS trying to get him to sleep and he started crying. Instead of doing something different or bringing him to me, he just kept doing the same thing, and DS kept getting more upset. Finally after asking him to bring him to me twice I yelled at him, "will you please bring him here before he gets gassy from being so upset and I have to stay up all night with a colicky baby!!??". And the other morning, DH got up with him before I did and when DS started crying he just shut the door. Oh hell no, I don't think so. Because of this, I don't even trust him to leave him alone with DS for an hour while I go do groceries or something. It's stressful on the relationship when you don't trust your spouse with your child AND you never get a break.

and as far as randomly choosing times to ignore my child, that's not the case. I was pointing out those examples because there are times when no, I CAN'T attend to him right away. If I'm on a highway and he's screaming and there's nowhere to pull over for the next 45 minutes safely, then I have to let him cry. It kills me, and usually I'm crying too, but there's nothing I can do. If I'm driving or in the back seat there's nothing I can do, he just wants out of his carseat and won't stop until he's out. If I have raw meat all over my hands and he's crying, he's going to have to wait until I wash my hands :P My point is that no matter what, he ALWAYS just escalates into full on screaming and NEVER calms down until he's picked up. (he is better in the car now that we have a convertible by the way, but he still has bad days). I wish I could always pick him up and comfort him but there are times in life when it's just not possible.

It's not like I jump at every peep he makes either. He has a fake cry that he does when he's just being fussy, say, he's mad at a toy he's playing with for whatever reason. He does a fake cough and a few complaints and then is happy playing again and I just leave him when he's doing that.

I just refuse to leave him to cry when he's not a real demanding baby and only cries when he needs something. DH doesn't get it. I tried to explain to him and I emailed him some studies which he says he'll read but whatever... He's probably at work complaining to all his coworkers who did CIO right now.

It just broke my heart when friends of ours were over with their baby and said that they left her to cry for an hour and a half at 4 months old. Are you kidding me???

I dunno... DH tells me I'm a good mom and then he goes out and takes advice from random people about how to raise our child as gospel and it makes me feel like he doesn't support me at all. It's just like the cloth diapers! He hates them, refuses to use them (although he's recently started using the all in ones when I remind him), refuses to wash them, and complains every chance he gets about them. I'm trying to do the best thing for my son and am getting put down at every turn.
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Old 04-01-2009, 10:57 AM   #18
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?



You've already been linked to lots of studies about CIO but I just wanted to offer hugs. I hope that you are able to get your DH on board with you on this. It must be very tough not having his full support on parenting decisions.
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Old 04-02-2009, 08:22 AM   #19
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Re: does anyone have any studies on why not to cry it out?

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It's stressful on the relationship when you don't trust your spouse with your child AND you never get a break.
I definately can relate. My DH just sits and stares at them (the twins) when they cry. After a couple minutes I will come in from the other room and when I ask him why he hasn't taken care of the baby, he replies "I don't know what's wrong with him (or her)". 9 times out of 10, it's a dirty diaper. It's pathetic that he won't even check, or doesn't even know to check, for a dirty diaper.

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I just refuse to leave him to cry when he's not a real demanding baby and only cries when he needs something.
I totally understand if you think there really is something. DS had reflux and it was SOOOO hard on me with both babies and a useless DH while recovering from a c-section. DD just sat and watched and she never made a peep unless something was wrong. I knew that I could let DS cry sometimes for a few minutes because he was just fussy and nothing (not holding, feeding, rocking, playing with, talking to, changing - nothing) made a difference. He just had to fuss himself to his nap. But if DD cried, something was wrong. All babies are different.


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It just broke my heart when friends of ours were over with their baby and said that they left her to cry for an hour and a half at 4 months old. Are you kidding me???
We let the twins CIO when they were 8 weeks old. It killed me. I was crying it out too. But, we started the babywise when DH had his wisdom teeth cut out and was off work for a few days. Plus, we were both up almost all night because he was on so many different medications for his mouth that had to be taken all through the night. So we were up almost all night and he actually did volunteer to go in and check on them to just make sure that they were okay and not rolled over or on their arm or something like that. I think it would have been a lot harder to convince myself to do it if I only had one baby though. With two, it was almost necessary. With one, I probably wouldn't have thought anything about it and honestly, would probably still be feeding in the middle of the night!

But like I said, I know they were waking out of habit and I am their mother and that is my decision just like everybody else has theirs. i would never do anything to hurt my children. I could have fed them a full feeding at 1:00am and they would still wake up at 2:00. I could have fed them at 7:00pm and they still woke up at 2:00am. I know this, because I tried it. My husband wasted a full tank of gas (back when it was $4 a gallon), driving one night to keep them asleep while I slept in the passenger seat of the car. They slept until 2:00, and then woke up.

It was hard and I am in no way trying to convince anybody to do it or change anybody's mind who is against it. But don't judge me or "cry" because of it. My children are very very happy and healthy. They are on a perfect schedule. They do not cry when they go down for a nap or bedtime (except when they are over-tired). They do not cry when they wake up. They "talk" to each other and play with their toys until I get them up.

Everybody has their beliefs and what they will or won't do. I'm sure there are things other mothers will do that I am 100% against. But I will say that even though it was extremely hard and painful to let them cry, it didn't last long, they were okay and in the end everybody is much happier.

BTW, I was unable to breastfeed so they were never EBF.
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