View Poll Results: Autism/Circ
Boy- intact and on the spectrum 7 6.86%
Boy- intact and not on the spectrum 35 34.31%
Boy- intact and too young to tell 18 17.65%
Boy- circ'd and on the spectrum 6 5.88%
Boy- circ'd and not on the spectrum 49 48.04%
Boy- circ'd and too young to tell 4 3.92%
Girl- on the spectrum 5 4.90%
Girl- not on the spectrum 29 28.43%
Girl- too young to tell 10 9.80%
Other 3 2.94%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 102. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-08-2012, 05:38 PM   #21
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I fail to see how circ 'ing can even effect brain chemistry at all. That would be like saying that removing a finger nail could alter brain chemistry.

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Old 07-08-2012, 06:05 PM   #22
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Re: Poll on autism and circumcision

My autistic family members are both adult women. We have a 10% circ rate here and have for decades and we have similar autism rates as the rest of the world, so yeah no connection.
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Old 07-08-2012, 06:45 PM   #23
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I fail to see how circ 'ing can even effect brain chemistry at all. That would be like saying that removing a finger nail could alter brain chemistry.
It's all based around circs done without pain medication; not the actual procedure itself. The pain from it (and I would imagine any other painful procedure done without pain medication) has been shown in a few studies to cause permanent changes in the brain. I believe it also factors in a baby's lack of ability to understand and process pain as an adult can as well, iirc.

That's why I said that is the only thing I could even see someone might wonder about in terms of circ and autism being related. All anaesthetics used are (as far as I know) the same ones that have been around for decades, haven't shown any adverse reactions in terms of autism, etc. So I don't see how circ'ing with actual pain relief could affect brain function, and autism is a brain related issue on all ends of the spectrum (correct me if I'm wrong on that, as I'm not familiar with all aspects of the spectrum) as far as I know. And I don't see how foreskin or lack thereof could affect it by itself. So the only thing even remotely possible IMO would be circ'ing with no pain relief, and even then as I said, the results are far from proven across the board. So I seriously doubt it's a contributing factor. Especially if you consider other countries rates of circ/intact vs. autism, and that while more prominent in boys, the numbers would certainly be well tipped in the favor of girls if that were the case; much more so than they are now.

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Old 07-08-2012, 06:45 PM   #24
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:26 AM   #25
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Re: Poll on autism and circumcision

i don't think there's a connection to circumcision, but i have often wondered if there is any connection to the use of pitocin. like maybe it is some sort of trigger to those prone to autism, since it is so widely used these days during labor and birth, but not so much before autism was on the rise.

ETA: not just autism, but things like ADHD, which seem to be on the rise in children as well compared to when I was a child.
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:38 AM   #26
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Re: Poll on autism and circumcision

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Originally Posted by Hillargh View Post
It's all based around circs done without pain medication; not the actual procedure itself. The pain from it (and I would imagine any other painful procedure done without pain medication) has been shown in a few studies to cause permanent changes in the brain. I believe it also factors in a baby's lack of ability to understand and process pain as an adult can as well, iirc.

That's why I said that is the only thing I could even see someone might wonder about in terms of circ and autism being related. All anaesthetics used are (as far as I know) the same ones that have been around for decades, haven't shown any adverse reactions in terms of autism, etc. So I don't see how circ'ing with actual pain relief could affect brain function, and autism is a brain related issue on all ends of the spectrum (correct me if I'm wrong on that, as I'm not familiar with all aspects of the spectrum) as far as I know. And I don't see how foreskin or lack thereof could affect it by itself. So the only thing even remotely possible IMO would be circ'ing with no pain relief, and even then as I said, the results are far from proven across the board. So I seriously doubt it's a contributing factor. Especially if you consider other countries rates of circ/intact vs. autism, and that while more prominent in boys, the numbers would certainly be well tipped in the favor of girls if that were the case; much more so than they are now.

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But, based on the pain theory, then more people should have autism as many people have chronic pain. All those people whose cannot be treated for it effectively should develop a form of "autism." Some people just have high pain tolerances so that kind of pain is not a big deal. I can get cavities filled without novocain (hate the feeling of it and the cavity will be filled in a few minutes and its far less painful than a bad migraine). So, by those standards I should have full blown autism.

I think a big factor is genetics. Autism and ADHD do tend to run in families. Way back when, you relative would have been called strange, quirky, crazy and a hole slew of terms. There is also probably a link to vac's for some as the chemicals could cause a reaction and now we lump everything together as "autism" vs. defining it better. Or, it could easily be environmental with the foods, housing environment (near XXX has shown to be a huge problem for some things like cancer) and medications taken by mom (or who knows even dad). No one knows. I think it was around way back when but all that stuff was hidden or termed something different.
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:38 AM   #27
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They have done preliminary studies linking a chemical found in many modern electronics to autistic behavior in rats who's mother's were exposed to certain levels while pregnant. It's very preliminary.

I personally feel it's a combination of genetic predisposition and some unknown type of chemical exposure, but just don't know. Everyone has a theory. One friend of mine thinks it has to do with ultrasounds, other people I know think it's everything from pesticides to processed foods. I doubt circumcision is a major factor. Haven't circumcision rates been goong down while autism rates continue to go up?
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:39 AM   #28
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Re: Poll on autism and circumcision

I am a mama of 4 boys that are intact, wouldn't ever considering circumcising one of our children...but I really find this theory to be way out there. I am very pro-intact...but how in the world would removing a foreskin trigger autism? I have a daughter and an intact son on the spectrum, I truly don't think that it has anything to do with it. I'm a little boggled by this thread and chose not to vote because of it...
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:57 AM   #29
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Mama to a intact, all natural out of hospital birthed, non vaccinated boy on the spectrum.
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Old 07-09-2012, 09:13 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by pcjs

But, based on the pain theory, then more people should have autism as many people have chronic pain. All those people whose cannot be treated for it effectively should develop a form of "autism." Some people just have high pain tolerances so that kind of pain is not a big deal. I can get cavities filled without novocain (hate the feeling of it and the cavity will be filled in a few minutes and its far less painful than a bad migraine). So, by those standards I should have full blown autism.

I think a big factor is genetics. Autism and ADHD do tend to run in families. Way back when, you relative would have been called strange, quirky, crazy and a hole slew of terms. There is also probably a link to vac's for some as the chemicals could cause a reaction and now we lump everything together as "autism" vs. defining it better. Or, it could easily be environmental with the foods, housing environment (near XXX has shown to be a huge problem for some things like cancer) and medications taken by mom (or who knows even dad). No one knows. I think it was around way back when but all that stuff was hidden or termed something different.
Very true to the top part.

To the bottom, so you think that's why they got rid of the spectrum in diagnoses? From what I've read, it seems now you either are, or aren't and "on the spectrum" isn't being used anymore? I wondered why that was started. It always seemed to me that every case of autism or spectrum disorders where so vastly different in some areas that there should be more in depth subcategories.

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