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Old 09-16-2012, 09:29 PM   #101
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Re: babywise

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Feel free to nurse your babies whenever or why-ever you choose. We don't snack nurse, we work towards full feedings to allow predictable hunger patterns to develop as a key portion of our routine. Its OK if it doesn't appeal to you or sounds different. It's what we do and it works for us and our babies very well. As it sounds bizarre to you to go 3-4 hours between nursings, so it sounds weird to me to nurse your baby because they're tired or crabby or scared or stubbed their toe. We're all doing what works for us and fits with our values and priorities and beliefs KWIM?
Oh, I get your last sentence for sure. But, you are comparing nursing for being crabby, scared, or a stubbed to when I'm nursing if they need a snack or are thirsty. But, I also EBF and don't give any water until they are 8-10 months old. Maybe a misconception on your part? B/c I don't nurse for the reasons you mentioned. I also would never go 3-4 hours during the day since their stomachs are only the size of their fists and breastmilk is so quickly digested.

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Old 09-16-2012, 09:32 PM   #102
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I'm sorry scheduling doesn't sound like fun to you and that you found your groove in another direction. That's awesome . As with BW, or AP, or co-sleeping or crib sleeping or any other area of debate in the mommy wars, scheduling isn't for everyone. The downside is a more structured lifestyle, but that's a win in many ways also. We love the inherent structure even 8 years later. Some would go bonkers with it as I would with everyday looking different and not knowing what's coming. We're different families and mommies with different needs and desires and priorities. For us, we love it and value what it produces in our homes and babies. We see the fruit of our path and choices.
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Old 09-16-2012, 09:38 PM   #103
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Oh, I get your last sentence for sure. But, you are comparing nursing for being crabby, scared, or a stubbed to when I'm nursing if they need a snack or are thirsty. But, I also EBF and don't give any water until they are 8-10 months old. Maybe a misconception on your part? B/c I don't nurse for the reasons you mentioned. I also would never go 3-4 hours during the day since their stomachs are only the size of their fists and breastmilk is so quickly digested.
I don't profess to know why you in-particular nurse or when, but was referring to reasons I have been told for "comfort nursing". We do EBF until 6-8 months with thriving babies also. We don't give snacks or drinks at the breast, we have big happy babies, that develop and sleep well. I can only say that I guess it works both ways? That's my frustration with the hostility shown towards scheduling/routining here on DS. It works as does your way. Its all good.
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Old 09-16-2012, 09:44 PM   #104
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Do any bw babies you know suffer from reflux? How do you get them to stay on that kind of schedule? My dd is inconsolable often bc of the reflux the only way to stop her crying is to let her nurse extra to sooth her tummy/throat or let her scream until it's time for a full feed. I've tried to put her on a schedule but she won't even sleep anywhere other than my arms bc of the pain.
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Old 09-16-2012, 10:02 PM   #105
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Do any bw babies you know suffer from reflux? How do you get them to stay on that kind of schedule? My dd is inconsolable often bc of the reflux the only way to stop her crying is to let her nurse extra to sooth her tummy/throat or let her scream until it's time for a full feed. I've tried to put her on a schedule but she won't even sleep anywhere other than my arms bc of the pain.
Sounds like my first guy. But he did not Have reflux. Just a high needs baby.

More failure to thrive babies are on 'schedules'. Something to keep in mind. If any baby is not gainning well, they should NOT be on a schedule for nursing.
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Old 09-16-2012, 10:04 PM   #106
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Re: babywise

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Do any bw babies you know suffer from reflux? How do you get them to stay on that kind of schedule? My dd is inconsolable often bc of the reflux the only way to stop her crying is to let her nurse extra to sooth her tummy/throat or let her scream until it's time for a full feed. I've tried to put her on a schedule but she won't even sleep anywhere other than my arms bc of the pain.
Yes, my DS1 suffered terribly from reflux. My Bestie H's #9 and My Bestie K's #9 were/are both reflux babies. Poor littles really suffer with reflux - its heart breaking. My son took Reglan for 4 months and Zantac for 6 due to projectile vomitting and esoph. erosion. The others have not. We do tummy sleep our reflux babies on the recommendation of our pediatricians (we all have different doctors). We do make sure their awake time after eating is all upright to ease their reflux. Each of our reflux babies have all coincidentally been paci babies for their first few months (supposedly common in reflux babies). We have not and do not allow our babies to be in pain or scream, ever. We elevated the heads of their cribs to help with reflux. The reflux babies have also not been able to extend their feeding intervals as quickly as other babies. In short, we mediated the reflux every way we could and never had further issues with sleeping or eating on routine. GL finding what works for you and big for you; I know how difficult a reflux baby can be. It is for a season, one day it will all be just a chapter in her story.
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Old 09-16-2012, 10:12 PM   #107
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More failure to thrive babies are on 'schedules'. Something to keep in mind. If any baby is not gainning well, they should NOT be on a schedule for nursing.
I totally agree. Scheduling definitely means us moms have to be extremely attentive to our milk supply. I have 2 ladies I have worked with who's babies stopped gaining well around 5-7 months. Come to find out, these babies were happy to eat every 4 hours and STTN but the moms weren't pumping or supplementing or anything and nearly lost their supply without realizing it. Fortunately, I was able to raid my freezer stash for them and get them started with More Milk and a pumping protocol and oatmeal to recover some of their supply. It doesn't always work as you can imagine. With their subsequent babies, both of them built freezer stash early and continued pumping until 11pm even when their littles dropped that feeding. Gary Ezzo discusses guarding our milk supply and recommends these very things also in Babywise.
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Old 09-16-2012, 10:19 PM   #108
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This is very common in BW babies, mine included. Though 6pm is very early. Its a choice, a lifestyle choice. If you want to come and go as you please and ask your LOs to catch naps in the BECO or car throughout the day, then feel free. This same child will likely fight you on nap or bedtime and may have more inconsistent sleep habits at home because they are accustomed to a little here, a little there, wherever, whenever. BW is all together different, and that's not for everyone. Indeed, our littles will meltdown if naptime is missed or ultra - delayed. They naturally are a little more flexible after a year, but yes, we are bound far more to our schedule as our babies are less forgiving of changes in routine and schedule. Its a tradeoff. For me it was always worth it to have to rush through errands etc... because I highly value predictable sleep for me and them. I love that my babies and toddlers and preschoolers ask for naps and smile and blow kisses and I lay them down and that's that. To this day my 4.5 DS2 cannot miss his afternoon nap or he's a total pill.
I don't have to deal with every day looking different. Our days are very predictable. We have a schedule - only I did not create it. I let them find their schedule then go with it. My kids all at a very young age have predictable schedules, that slowly evolve as the age. Also as they get older it is very easy for me to then tweak those schedules so that they all nap at the same time. My 3 and 2 year old go to bed happily on there own every night and for naps. They are not made to catch a small nap here or their. They get a good nap at the same time most days. However, they do have the ability to change that nap time or even skip it from time to time is life calls for it. I like that I can without worry of a melt down take children to an evening wedding or spend a whole day at the zoo. I am glad you have what works for you but but for me not forcing a schedule has been great for us. I feel like my children are very well rounded and adjustable but also very predictable.
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Old 09-16-2012, 10:33 PM   #109
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I don't have to deal with every day looking different. Our days are very predictable. We have a schedule - only I did not create it. I let them find their schedule then go with it. My kids all at a very young age have predictable schedules, that slowly evolve as the age. Also as they get older it is very easy for me to then tweak those schedules so that they all nap at the same time. My 3 and 2 year old go to bed happily on there own every night and for naps. They are not made to catch a small nap here or their. They get a good nap at the same time most days. However, they do have the ability to change that nap time or even skip it from time to time is life calls for it. I like that I can without worry of a melt down take children to an evening wedding or spend a whole day at the zoo. I am glad you have what works for you but but for me not forcing a schedule has been great for us. I feel like my children are very well rounded and adjustable but also very predictable.
Fantastic! Yes, we also change naptime quite a bit over a year of age as do our friends. Not because we say but because it seems to be about 10 months or so when we can really build in flexibility and our littles are prepared to handle it. We do not miss naps in this house, ever, (some BW families can and do, just not me) but often push bedtime considerably with ours as well. Different babies and different families can handle different amounts of flexibility, much of which can be worked very easily into a BW routine.
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Old 09-16-2012, 10:35 PM   #110
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I totally agree. Scheduling definitely means us moms have to be extremely attentive to our milk supply. I have 2 ladies I have worked with who's babies stopped gaining well around 5-7 months. Come to find out, these babies were happy to eat every 4 hours and STTN but the moms weren't pumping or supplementing or anything and nearly lost their supply without realizing it. Fortunately, I was able to raid my freezer stash for them and get them started with More Milk and a pumping protocol and oatmeal to recover some of their supply. It doesn't always work as you can imagine. With their subsequent babies, both of them built freezer stash early and continued pumping until 11pm even when their littles dropped that feeding. Gary Ezzo discusses guarding our milk supply and recommends these very things also in Babywise.
Woah! That's a lot of work! But, yes, every Babywise mom I know stopped nursing at 7-8 months because she "dried up." Unfortunately, it's not only about demand at the time of the supply dip--it's about not laying down the prolactin levels the first three months that feeding on cue and allowing flutter-sucking/sleeping on the breast facilitate, naturally, by our design as human beings.

Active management is not my strength as a mother, haha. I guess I don't really value predictability, and I see it as kind of a strange value. But, you know, there are so many areas of my life where I'm very, very industrialized/not "paleo," to borrow the term from the nutrition trend. So I can understand wanting a paradigm that serves an industrialized culture's values. It's just counter to all my reading, so it strikes me as odd.
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