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Old 10-06-2012, 06:01 PM   #31
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

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Originally Posted by RainandRedemption View Post
milosmama~ everything you said is pretty much how I look at it too. Also, my son's name is also Milo. We must just think alike



Well that example I don't really consider lying. One teacher tells yo uone thing in grade 4 and you learn something on top of that in grade 5. Two different people, in a "strategy" effort to teach writting.

But the "edit information" part. I get editing, and adding to, and what not. But with things that children are naturally curious about and asking questions, if the answer they get is not truthful, and they build their understanding of the world around what they were told, then doesn't that uproot their security in their ability to understanding life when they find out that was just a childish, dream world way of looking at it?
I think I get what you are saying now. However, I can't imagine that any parent will go out intentionally lying to their children in that way. The dog example you gave, in my mind is just editing. Unless they never explain what the "new house" is later on when the child is older and can understand better. In that case it would be a lie, and I think it would be cruel too. Kids need to learn about and understand death.

The biggest lies I was told as a child, the people telling them to me didn't believe they were lies. It was what they sincerely believed and wanted my world view to be like that. Those could have done me harm and may have until I got "educated". For example, blacks are inferior to whites; men are better than women; adults are always right.

I think we know a bit better as parents not to tell those lies anymore.

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Old 10-06-2012, 06:07 PM   #32
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

I don't believe in lying and I try not to lie to my kids or mislead them. (Nor do I purposely lie or mislead anyone else.) I give them information about what they ask on an age appropriate level. I do not purposely mislead them, but I may not give all the details either. I don't believe that not giving all details is lying unless you are doing it to purposely mislead someone. With my children, my purpose is to give age appropriate answers that are true but not mislead or deceive and definitely not outright lie.
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Old 10-06-2012, 06:26 PM   #33
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

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Originally Posted by RainandRedemption View Post
I'm just curious to know people's thoughts on this.

Lying as in; intentionally giving them a false view of something, whether by telling them something that's not true or withholding information to give a false perspective.

First question is ~ Is it possible? Second question is ~ Do you attempt to parent without lying?

I do intentionally withhold some information from them, but I don't consider it lying. Take "stranger danger" for instance. I tell them, "So people have bad hearts and because we can't see someone's heart, we can't trust everyone we meet, even when they look nice or talk nice." I intentionally DON'T say, "There are child rapists out there who prey on girls like you." I am not telling them everything on purpose because it isn't age appropriate. Same things with the sex talk or divorce or heavy things like that. SO yes, I do attempt to parent without lying, but I do withhold some things because they aren't ready to know.
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Old 10-06-2012, 06:28 PM   #34
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

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I just mean something that you, yourself, do not believe is true. Like with the neighbors dog dying, your child asks where the dog went. If you say "he went to a new home" you can say that's a true statement becaus eyou believe the dogs soul is in heaven or in the cosmos or whatever,. But if you know that now your 3yo thinks the doggy moved to a new town, then you're giving a false perspective
In that case I would never say, "He went to a new home." I would just simply say, "He died honey. It is sad and it's okay to cry. But we love you and we loved our doggy." or something.
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Old 10-06-2012, 06:38 PM   #35
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

the question:

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I can't quote well on this thing but want to ask Emily, what about if your kid walks in on you during sex? Or asks a sex question before your ready? Also what if in the death question, they over hear specific terms and ask you their meaning like horrible things like molested, dismembered or the like? What if your not old enough to know doesn't work?. Or are sensitive like PP example?

I also know age and personality really make a hge difference in some of these questions too, more then anything.
one good answer:

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We don't lie to our kids. ODD has walked in on us having sex and later asked what we were doing. I told her mommy and daddy were having some special time together and she needs to knock before walking into our room. She kept asking and I told her that it was private between mommy and daddy and none of her business. She's 5...I'm not going all out on a graphic answer. Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are all pretend things we do for fun.
About the rest - things they hear - dismemberment or whatever, I would try to be truthful. Especially about molestation. I realized very much later in life that I was molested at a young age by my eldest sister's boyfriend. It happened once and I didn't realize what happened - I was young and naive.

there's really not an age when it's not okay to explain how it's not okay for people to have their hands in private places. If my 2yo understood, I'd tell her. She's recently discovered her vagina, she needs to know that no one else is allowed and she shouldn't show anyone.

As for an exceptionally sensitive child, I cannot say. You can't hide the world from them, but you certainly have a tougher job explaining it.
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Old 10-06-2012, 07:29 PM   #36
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

Personally, I think breaking things down to give an appropriate age level response is not the whole truth and nothing but the truth. It is purposely geared to be vague in details, inaccurate enough to glaze over the nitty gritty, and fluffed up to avoid going into details of the nitty gritty ie. sex = puzzle pieces that fit together. I do believe a half truth, glossed over, is the way to do it though, until they are ready for the real gory details of life. That being said, I try to be as accurate as possible and still try to preserve their innocence at the same time. Most of the time I preface anything I try to explain by asking what they know, think or feel about it first.

Let's talk about no information or vague information as misleading to your child as a lie would be, because it would lead them to have a different idea than what you have. Hypothetically, Lets say, that if you were not comfortable talking about details with your child who walked in on you having sex and was asking too many detailed questions, and you leave it at "mommy and daddies special time". What if unbeknownst to you they thought you guys were hurting each other based on the noises? Wouldn't they think it was something very different than what you thought it was? How would you know unless you ask them, "What do you think we were doing?"

I am often astounded when I ask children what they know or think or feel about a subject, that they have a far more detailed idea of how things work than what I was about to "dumb down" to them or how totally inaccurate they were to begin with.

My eldest thought that if you were a bad person over time your skin would change color, because the blackness seeps out. It was an misinterpretation of information from Sunday school, where they described sin as a darkness in the soul and how it spills out and effects everyone. He took it a step farther, much to my distress. He thought he was going bad because he was getting tan from the sun. I would hate to think he thought people of color were particularly sinful, especially since his dad is half Chilean, and stressed the point about sin not actually coloring people, and that melanin was actually responsible for skin color not sin.

Things I do lie about or try to give false information about to purposely mislead my children:

1. Santa, Tooth fairy, Easter Bunny.
2. When mommy and daddy go "take a nap", we are not napping 100% of the time.
3. When it gets dark the whole world goes to bed.
4. There are no scary things that go bump in the night.

I'm sure there are other things that I can't think of right now.

Everything else we are as honest and real as possible.

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Originally Posted by vatblack View Post
The biggest lies I was told as a child, the people telling them to me didn't believe they were lies. It was what they sincerely believed and wanted my world view to be like that. Those could have done me harm and may have until I got "educated". For example, blacks are inferior to whites; men are better than women; adults are always right.

I think we know a bit better as parents not to tell those lies anymore.
I certainly would hope so, but I still overhear some outrageous things being told to kids!

Here is another question, that goes with vatblacks statement about lies told to her while she was growing up. What if what you believe goes against 99% of what the rest of the world believes, you know this and yet tell your child differently. Does your child deserve to know the truth or the truth as you see it? For instance you believe the Earth is flat and you teach your kids the Earth is flat and they are home schooled.
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Last edited by rumblepurr; 10-06-2012 at 07:32 PM.
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Old 10-06-2012, 08:01 PM   #37
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

I don't think it is possible, TBH, but I think that has more to do with my perception of truth and lie. I believe any time you edit or omit information you are lying, so, I do lie to my children. Regardless of Santa, the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, etc... I omit information all the time.

My DS recently came home and asked DH if he had ever done drugs. A police officer had come into the classroom and spoken about drugs and bad effects of drugs on your body. Well, my DH had dabbled a bit in his past. We agree that one day he can tell the kids, when it is an appropriate life lesson. Not at 6 years old, however, so DH was vague and redirected him into more chatting about how dangerous drugs can be. Definitely lying.

My mother was an alcoholic at the end of her life. She drank herself to death when my DD was 3. DD loved her, and was, of course, completely unaware that Nana had a drinking problem because that is beyond the realm of her understanding. She asked me outright why Nana died. I told her Nana died because she didn't take care of her body. As she has grown, I have fed her more information, at my discretion, and as I see fit for her to understand. I want her to have a clear picture of the truth about alcoholism, because it is rampant in my family. But, she was not yet equipped to know and understand everything, so I lied.

Recently a young girl was snatched while walking home from school. A lady and her boyfriend hurt her terribly and killed her in horrific circumstances. The missing child case, the discovery and the trial were all over the news for a long time. Again, I protected my children from it, and I gave answers as I saw fit. One day, DD and I were alone in the car and the news report gave an update on a filed appeal regarding the case. She asked me about it, and I recapped what we had spoken about already. She asked me more. I answered her, within certain parameters. She asked me, "HOW did they hurt the little girl, Mummy? What did they do to her?" We talked about bad touch, again, etc... and I talked about how they hurt her so much that she died. "But HOW? What exactly did they do to her?" No, I am sorry, I am not telling my then 8 yo that someone could hurt a little girl like that so I lied. I said I was not sure exactly what they did to her. Not just omission, outright lie, because she does not need to KNOW the intimate details.

I firmly believe in answering kids' questions to the best of my ability and at an appropriate level for their personal development. But, when you have tenacious and curious kids, sometimes things need to be hedged a bit.
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Old 10-06-2012, 08:29 PM   #38
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Re: Is it possible to parent your children without lying to them? Do you try?

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Originally Posted by Geckmumto3 View Post
I don't think it is possible, TBH, but I think that has more to do with my perception of truth and lie. I believe any time you edit or omit information you are lying, so, I do lie to my children. Regardless of Santa, the Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, etc... I omit information all the time.

My DS recently came home and asked DH if he had ever done drugs. A police officer had come into the classroom and spoken about drugs and bad effects of drugs on your body. Well, my DH had dabbled a bit in his past. We agree that one day he can tell the kids, when it is an appropriate life lesson. Not at 6 years old, however, so DH was vague and redirected him into more chatting about how dangerous drugs can be. Definitely lying.

My mother was an alcoholic at the end of her life. She drank herself to death when my DD was 3. DD loved her, and was, of course, completely unaware that Nana had a drinking problem because that is beyond the realm of her understanding. She asked me outright why Nana died. I told her Nana died because she didn't take care of her body. As she has grown, I have fed her more information, at my discretion, and as I see fit for her to understand. I want her to have a clear picture of the truth about alcoholism, because it is rampant in my family. But, she was not yet equipped to know and understand everything, so I lied.

Recently a young girl was snatched while walking home from school. A lady and her boyfriend hurt her terribly and killed her in horrific circumstances. The missing child case, the discovery and the trial were all over the news for a long time. Again, I protected my children from it, and I gave answers as I saw fit. One day, DD and I were alone in the car and the news report gave an update on a filed appeal regarding the case. She asked me about it, and I recapped what we had spoken about already. She asked me more. I answered her, within certain parameters. She asked me, "HOW did they hurt the little girl, Mummy? What did they do to her?" We talked about bad touch, again, etc... and I talked about how they hurt her so much that she died. "But HOW? What exactly did they do to her?" No, I am sorry, I am not telling my then 8 yo that someone could hurt a little girl like that so I lied. I said I was not sure exactly what they did to her. Not just omission, outright lie, because she does not need to KNOW the intimate details.

I firmly believe in answering kids' questions to the best of my ability and at an appropriate level for their personal development. But, when you have tenacious and curious kids, sometimes things need to be hedged a bit.
To the bolded~ I agree with the first statement but not the second

With your ds, I don't think redirecting or ignoring a question is lying. If he never said he didn't then I would think you DS will come back later and say "remember I asked you this? you didn't answer"

With your mom, I don't think what you told her is lying.

The news story... Idk what I would do. I try to avoid listening to stories like that and most of the time don't get all the details. Hopefully I would truthfully be able to say "I don't know exactly what they did/how she died"
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Old 10-06-2012, 08:35 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by RainandRedemption

To the bolded~ I agree with the first statement but not the second

With your ds, I don't think redirecting or ignoring a question is lying. If he never said he didn't then I would think you DS will come back later and say "remember I asked you this? you didn't answer"

With your mom, I don't think what you told her is lying.

The news story... Idk what I would do. I try to avoid listening to stories like that and most of the time don't get all the details. Hopefully I would truthfully be able to say "I don't know exactly what they did/how she died"
I agree. I wouldn't call most of that lying. It was true for the age appropriateness. Your mom didn't take care of herself - how isnt the issue - its true.
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Old 10-06-2012, 08:41 PM   #40
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it's possible. i don't lie to my kids ever or withhold info to give a false perspective. saying, "i'm not comfortable discussing that right now" is the truth
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