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Old 05-17-2013, 10:10 AM   #11
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Re: I'm at my wits end with ds....

I still can't come up with a way to do it. It's different for me, because I have been working with kids for many years, and I have the "teacher" voice down so that it's natural. It was trained into me from my junior year in high school until I got it right.

So, I don't know how to tell others to avoid getting into the situation in the first place. It's so embarrassing, and suddenly you just feel like everybody is watching and judging you. I bet some were....but, most were thinking "Poor woman" and the rest were thinking "I'd kill him". But, I would bet that not one parent there was thinking "Oh, she's hurting that poor child". So, I would let him scream. Let them judge, and just keep moving. If it happens again, just get through it, and think about what you could have done differently BEFORE is escalated.

First, never chase or catch. Ever. Just watch, then when he comes back, it's time to leave.

There's nothing wrong with asking the coach to tell him "You are out of this game, go sit on the bench".

Certain situations really SHOULD be handled by the coach or the teacher, not the parent. If he's doing something wrong, the coach should say something to him. He should already have the "coach voice". If your son still doesn't listen to the coach, then the game should be over for your son.

Don't get into a battle that you might not possibly win. It was only grass. The kids could handle that on their own.

Here is the only thing I found that made sense. The rest was just parents spouting nonsense because they were mad at their kids. (who can blame them?)

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Way to Blow It #2: Back Down

You want a surefire way to make sure your kids never listen to you? Threaten but don't act. My daughter Ella and I recently went for a playdate at a friend's house, where the little girl kept snatching away whatever toy Ella picked up. Her mom would say, "Give that back to Ella or I'll take it away," and then turn back to our conversation. Of course, as soon as Ella moved on to another toy, the little girl wanted that one.

A Better Way: It's no fun to be the bad guy, but if a child acts out, there has to be a consequence. "Repeatedly saying 'If you don't stop throwing sand, I'm going to make you leave the sandbox' won't stop the bad behavior," says Bridget Barnes, coauthor of Common Sense Parenting for Toddlers and Preschoolers. "What your child hears is 'I can keep doing this a few more times before Mom makes me stop.'"

Instead, give a warning, and then, if your child does it again, give an immediate consequence such as a time-out. If he continues, leave. The next time, a gentle reminder should do the trick: "Remember how we had to leave when you threw the sand? I hope we don't have to go home early again today."
I LOVED the book "Love and Logic for teens". I didn't read the other books, but maybe the younger books would be helpful. If you do read any books, remember that not ALL of the book is helpful. One book is not useful if you try to follow it to a T.

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Old 05-17-2013, 10:31 AM   #12
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Re: I'm at my wits end with ds....



my only advice is don't tell him the consequence from afar. I know it's a pain to get up (especially pregnant) but I have had much better success with a consequence if I go and physically touch or hold the child and tell them firmly but quietly close to their face what they should not do. "I need you to stop throwing grass, please play nicely." The next time he does it, walk over in the exact same way, then get down and say "Because you did not listen, you need to sit with me now." Then take their hand and walk with them back to the seat. No chasing!
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Old 05-17-2013, 10:38 AM   #13
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Re: I'm at my wits end with ds....

Don't you sometimes wish you had a remote control zapper? Just a mild zap.
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Old 05-17-2013, 02:09 PM   #14
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I'm going to look up the poker chip thing. The coaches are volunteer parents so I don't want to put it on them, ya know? I try to avoid getting into a power struggle so that we don't have to leave places. But sometimes it just has to happen.

@Palooka: That's exactly how I did it, I walked over to him to give the warning, then walked over again and tried to lead him back to where i was sitting. His coach told him to stop when he was throwing rocks in the outfield earlier. He did end up walking in the end because I told him I was leaving either way. So he started screaming bloody murder "don't leave me!" That tactic is my last resort when I physically can't control him. Idk, I feel like everyone thought I was being harsh by leaving a little early. And I'm sure they were all glad that their kid doesn't act like that. We went through the same thing less than 2 weeks ago when it was time to leave a park play date and he didn't want to go. I ended up dragging/walking him across the park screaming. I feel so helpless in those situations and want a black hole to swallow me up.

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Old 05-17-2013, 03:14 PM   #15
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Re: I'm at my wits end with ds....

Let me say from the perspective of the coaching staff (DH is mid-way through year 2 coaching tball and assistant coaching machine pitch)..... you did the right thing

We have two OUT OF CONTROL kids.... and i'm not talking defiant, grass throwing behavior - I'm talking bat throwing, stomping on kids feet if they are put on a base (eg stamping on the opposing childs feet while waiting for the next play), dumping water bottles/gatoraide on the other kids, etc. We have 14 kids on the team and yes, they are 5yr old boys who like to goof off and that's fine and expected but the two we have this year are on another realm where they are deliberately trying to HARM and i WISH we could get involved parents who cared. These two little boys parents just sit there and do nothing, and DH now has to have a special meeting with the players and their parents because it has escalated to the point where they are an imminent danger to EVERYONE.....

So just know that everyone may have given you a bad look, and i TOTALLY would have cried too, but you did the best you could, stood your ground and i say WTG mama!
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Old 05-17-2013, 04:21 PM   #16
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Re: I'm at my wits end with ds....

Just wanted to say, I admire when parents stick to their guns and follow through. I'd rather see that than some parent being all wishy washy and not disciplining their child. I had one parent interview about me doing daycare for their child and he punched his mom in the face, after hitting her in the face twice and all she said was, "no thank you, no thank you". he was 3. Anyway, I would have felt bad for you but have thought you were doing the right thing. You weren't screaming at him either and berating him or beating him. Kids keep us humble.
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Old 05-17-2013, 06:00 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by escapethevillage
Don't you sometimes wish you had a remote control zapper? Just a mild zap.
Hahaha!
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Old 05-17-2013, 06:07 PM   #18
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Great advice - I'm putting some away for future reference.

But something I thought of that you may do, but may not. You mentioned the ordeal leaving the park... Do you give him a 10 or 5 min warning? To avoid tantrums leaving, my sister tells me that she cannot just get up and say 'time to go', she has to give a countdown - 'we're leaving in 5 min' and then '4 more minutes', etc. helps them prepare.

If I had been at the ballpark, I would have been proud of you for taking care of the situation. I would have felt awful for you, but not judged you. You did good.
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Old 05-17-2013, 07:34 PM   #19
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Re: I'm at my wits end with ds....

I agree that it is embarrassing. To the point of tears and extreme frustration. I've been in that situation, and it is horrible. You did a fine job, so don't beat yourself up.

I agree that you should not give repeated warnings. Once, just once, tell him what you expect (make sure you have his attention, so you know he hears you), tell him what will happen if he fails to obey or whatever, and then follow through. Yes, it is hard, esp. being pregnant (I can relate, I am currently pregnant with 5 older children), but it is worth the effort. When he fails to obey, enforce with the already stated consequence, and act as if nothing at all in the world is wrong, like you are not the slightest bit bothered by the ensuing tantrum. I would not even say anything at all; just get up, enforce the consequence, and move on. (Feel free to have your own meltdown and tears in private later, lol!) Having a child who has, thankfully, grown out of this, I think that sometimes they put on the tantrum because they know how uncomfortable it makes us as parents. Sometimes, it is genuine, but sometimes, I think it is part of the show for onlookers.

When you are both calm, go back to your child and process the event together. "I told you that X would happen when you did Y. You did Y, and X happened. You felt really upset and you didn't like it when X happened. I felt sad that we had to (leave early, miss out on something, etc.), but that is what happens when you cannot/will not listen to Mama. Maybe next time you will remember to listen, and we will be able to do (whatever special thing it is)." Put the ball in his court, and get him involved in changing his behaviour. When he *does* listen/obey right away, make a huge fuss over it! Talk it up like it is the best thing since sliced bread, and make him feel like he just conquered the world, even if it is over a very small thing. Sometimes, they need to feel success, even if it is a very small one.

We have a rule that if the child cannot obey while they are out with the parent, that child does not get to go out again next time. They usually only test that rule once or twice. Be absolutely consistent and utterly unmoved and unfazed by his emotional outbursts. It's ok to acknowledge your own frustration to him when you process it later, but in the moment, don't allow his emotional meltdown to suck you in. I used to mentally don my protective bubble when my DS would have a meltdown in order to maintain my sanity. He was the king of selective hearing and tantrums, lol.

As a word of encouragement, I would also like to say that my DS has now grown into a lovely teen who is mostly responsible and respectful. I know your son will, too, even though you probably have days where you think he won't make it to his next birthday.
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Old 05-17-2013, 10:16 PM   #20
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Re: I'm at my wits end with ds....

Order the Kazdin book Parenting the Defiant Child. It is a great, easy read. It was recommended to me by our developmental pediatrician, and it definitely helps a LOT. My son has oppositional defiant disorder (was diagnosed at 4 because he is severe), and Kazdin is a gentle parenting method that is research based and extremely effective. No yelling. No spanking. Positive reinforcement with creating situations to practice target behaviors. It really changed how we are dealing with him, and we are seeing great changes.
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