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Old 10-10-2008, 06:55 AM   #1
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Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

Ok well I'm sure some of you have heard this scenario before, but I just don't know what to do anymore and now that I've asked my peds advice, I am even more confused than ever.

So my son is going to be 9 months old in 10 days.
He won't sleep through the night - never has, never slept longer than 4 hours in a stretch. He is a relatively happy and healthy baby...he's a tiny peanut, but nevertheless, still a happy baby.

However.....recently he seems to me less satisfied, less satiated, just more hungry or irritated. The only time he stays his cute happy self is when he is full or after a nap or both. He doesn't have gas, he doesn't throw up large amounts of food, just normal spit ups if he doesn't burp all the way.

At night he wakes up (if I put him to bed at 8pm) at the same times every night: 11pm, 3am, 5am, 7am and then is up for the day with a nap at 9:30am and 2pm. Of course there are variants here and there. If I put him to bed earlier or later, he still wakes up at the same exact time frames, the times are just adjusted according to when he actually went to bed. But this has been going on for months! He will not go back to sleep unless he nurses. I gave up trying just rocking him to sleep. But recently what I'm giving him isn't enough. He still cries for more. Before he wouldn't take a bottle of anything and he HATES formula. I couldn't even give him a bottle of my breastmilk, he just refused the bottle. Only recently he's taking a sippy cup with meals during the day and now finally he takes a bottle. I gave him some cow milk, but I'm afraid it's too early for that - but I was desperate one night. My mom even gave him some Silk (soy milk) this past weekend when she babysat because she ran out of my breastmilk. He likes both.

Anyway, I called the pediatrician for some advice because really I've been feeding him so much I just don't know what's going on. I remember back in the day they tried to tell me I wasn't feeding him enough. Now this time they are telling me I am feeding him too much!!!!! And when I say that, they also mean they don't like that I'm feeding him 3 times a day with table food. I give him fruits, veggies, and some chicken sometimes. I tell them, well isn't that the same as what you get in the little jars? Even stage 3 has chicken in it. They said he shouldn't be eating that stuff until he is a year old - solids that is - not pureed stuff. But basically told me to curb that and old feed him baby stuff - I guess like cereal and pureed fruit etc. But I've been feeding him rice, beans, fruit, chicken, bread, etc....it's not like I'm sticking a piece of steak in front of him. Really, I need to wait until the magic 1st birthday for this stuff?????

Anyway, she insists that if I can't pump enough bm for night feedings to give him a bottle instead of the actual boob, that I should use formula, not cow milk or soy milk. Well, I did wonder about that, but why not? She didn't say why. Is it bad for them? I just can't get over that people prefer we give the babies some synthetic man-made gross powder stuff over something natural like cow milk. I'm not trying to replace my bm, just give something at night. Really, I don't want him to eat anything at all at night. She also told me I'm going to have to "take control" and let him cry it out if I want him to sleep.

How can I do that? I've tried letting him cry but it goes on and on and it's the middle of the night, his crib is in our bedroom, my husband and I are so tired and annoyed from months of no sleep, we even had to take his crib out of our toddler's room because he would wake her up too. I can't just ignore him if he's right there standing up in his crib screaming at me while I lay there in the bed. Not only will one of us end up punching the wall in, but it just doesn't feel right, doesn't feel natural. Key word in all of this is NATURAL.

How can I get my baby to sleep through the night and feed him supplements that are NATURAL. Last night he breastfed and I did my best to make it last as long as I could and then just rocked him the rest of the way to sleep. Some feedings have less milk because they are so soon after the last. He usually just is happy to go back in his crib and roll over and pass out after he eats - even if I just make him eat a bowl of oatmeal cereal and not nurse at all, so I know it's just hunger. I added a 6:00am waking in the mix too.

Any advice? I don't know what to do I am at my wits end with exhaustion.

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Last edited by statikradio; 10-10-2008 at 06:59 AM.
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:07 AM   #2
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

My son was the exact same way in fact even now at almost 3 he still hasn't slept an entire night. The only difference now it that he can get out of his own bed to come in our room and he doesn't nurse anymore We just hung in there. DH would take the baby every once in awhile for at least part of the night and put him to sleep when he woke up. That really helped a lot. He is still really young IMHO but if you wanted to start night weaning make sure he nurses more during the day so he won't want to at night as much. Have your dh (or someone that can't nurse him) put him to bed for a few night so he gets used to it. Try to set goals like I am only going to nurse him twice tonight and slowly wean him off. Ds had reflux pretty bad to so thats why he was always up. Do you think that could be it? The medicine didn't help us at all (well no longer then an hour or so then it would wear off but we could only give it three times a day) but I started taking enzymes to break down my food and they helped ds tremendously! When he got older we also started giving him chamomile tea (cooled to warm) and that settled him down and his stomach felt better. The other thing it sounds like it could be is a growth spurt. It makes even the best sleeper wake up several times a night to nurse. Dd has slept through the night since she was born but she always wakes up a lot when she is growing. I know it seems tough now but there is and end!! My aunt once told me all her kids didn't start sleeping through the night until about 5 or so. SHe had all 5 of her kids getting up through the night (including a set of twins) until then. I always look to those kind of people to keep going and to lean on they know how it is!!
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:18 AM   #3
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

My DD is 14 months and still doesn't sleep through the night and is up at least twice each night.

When did you start solids? Even though he might not be gassy, some of the foods you are feeding him might be upsetting his tummy.
He really doesn't need meat or protein until he is over a year old. He gets enough protein from your breastmilk. Meat isn't easily digested. I would wait. But my feeding practices were to wait until my children were close to a year old before introducing solids. My DD was close to 11 months when she started some solids...her first was avacado. My Ds was around 10 months when he started. I know everyone starts at different ages, but solids are really just for practice when they are before a year old...well at least in my opinion.
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:19 AM   #4
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

Ok, Please do yourself a favor and READ The Baby Sleep Book by Dr. Sears.
It saved my life. My son had a similar sleep schedule, but with some slight modifications to his routine he can sleep 9-10 hours at night now, with 1 feeding somewhere in there.

Make sure that you are in a good routine. When he starts getting tired, make sure no TVs, no radios, nothing loud or stimulating is going on. When you put him down for the night, make sure the room is completely dark (a night light is ok though). Make sure that you have the most relaxed environment in the evening time. The more stimulating, the more stress hormones will be in his body, resulting in crumby sleep.
You might want to put a shirt in the crib with him,one that you have wore all day. This will help him feel not so alone.

As far as the BF issue goes, have you tried to do anything to boost your supply? Fenugreek? Formula is the next 'best' thing to BM. It has more nutritional value than milk does, thats why its recommended. Hopefully some other BFing moms can help you out with this. I could only BF for 3 months because of 'no supply' issues. I can say that if you do have to supplement with formula, you can try to use an SNS system (Starter Supplemental Nursing System), Medela sells them. That way you can still offer him breast, but he will be able to be supplemented enough to sleep all night as well.
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:21 AM   #5
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

Quote:
Originally Posted by statikradio View Post
Ok well I'm sure some of you have heard this scenario before, but I just don't know what to do anymore and now that I've asked my peds advice, I am even more confused than ever.

So my son is going to be 9 months old in 10 days.
He won't sleep through the night - never has, never slept longer than 4 hours in a stretch. He is a relatively happy and healthy baby...he's a tiny peanut, but nevertheless, still a happy baby.

However.....recently he seems to me less satisfied, less satiated, just more hungry or irritated. The only time he stays his cute happy self is when he is full or after a nap or both. He doesn't have gas, he doesn't throw up large amounts of food, just normal spit ups if he doesn't burp all the way.

At night he wakes up (if I put him to bed at 8pm) at the same times every night: 11pm, 3am, 5am, 7am and then is up for the day with a nap at 9:30am and 2pm. Of course there are variants here and there. If I put him to bed earlier or later, he still wakes up at the same exact time frames, the times are just adjusted according to when he actually went to bed. But this has been going on for months! He will not go back to sleep unless he nurses. I gave up trying just rocking him to sleep. But recently what I'm giving him isn't enough. He still cries for more. Before he wouldn't take a bottle of anything and he HATES formula. I couldn't even give him a bottle of my breastmilk, he just refused the bottle. Only recently he's taking a sippy cup with meals during the day and now finally he takes a bottle. I gave him some cow milk, but I'm afraid it's too early for that - but I was desperate one night. My mom even gave him some Silk (soy milk) this past weekend when she babysat because she ran out of my breastmilk. He likes both.

Anyway, I called the pediatrician for some advice because really I've been feeding him so much I just don't know what's going on. I remember back in the day they tried to tell me I wasn't feeding him enough. Now this time they are telling me I am feeding him too much!!!!! And when I say that, they also mean they don't like that I'm feeding him 3 times a day with table food. I give him fruits, veggies, and some chicken sometimes. I tell them, well isn't that the same as what you get in the little jars? Even stage 3 has chicken in it. They said he shouldn't be eating that stuff until he is a year old - solids that is - not pureed stuff. But basically told me to curb that and old feed him baby stuff - I guess like cereal and pureed fruit etc. But I've been feeding him rice, beans, fruit, chicken, bread, etc....it's not like I'm sticking a piece of steak in front of him. Really, I need to wait until the magic 1st birthday for this stuff?????

Anyway, she insists that if I can't pump enough bm for night feedings to give him a bottle instead of the actual boob, that I should use formula, not cow milk or soy milk. Well, I did wonder about that, but why not? She didn't say why. Is it bad for them? I just can't get over that people prefer we give the babies some synthetic man-made gross powder stuff over something natural like cow milk. I'm not trying to replace my bm, just give something at night. Really, I don't want him to eat anything at all at night. She also told me I'm going to have to "take control" and let him cry it out if I want him to sleep.

How can I do that? I've tried letting him cry but it goes on and on and it's the middle of the night, his crib is in our bedroom, my husband and I are so tired and annoyed from months of no sleep, we even had to take his crib out of our toddler's room because he would wake her up too. I can't just ignore him if he's right there standing up in his crib screaming at me while I lay there in the bed. Not only will one of us end up punching the wall in, but it just doesn't feel right, doesn't feel natural. Key word in all of this is NATURAL.

How can I get my baby to sleep through the night and feed him supplements that are NATURAL. Last night he breastfed and I did my best to make it last as long as I could and then just rocked him the rest of the way to sleep. Some feedings have less milk because they are so soon after the last. He usually just is happy to go back in his crib and roll over and pass out after he eats - even if I just make him eat a bowl of oatmeal cereal and not nurse at all, so I know it's just hunger. I added a 6:00am waking in the mix too.

Any advice? I don't know what to do I am at my wits end with exhaustion.

Have you thought about calling LLL? I'm sure they would have some help for you as far as your milk supply at least. That way, one less thing to worry about (no need to supplement).
No body shoot me for this (just my parenting approach), but when DS #2 was like that (although he was only 3 mo), I finally just brought him to bed with us! It was CO-SLEEPING OR NO SLEEPING, baby, and I chose co-sleeping!
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:29 AM   #6
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

Wow, now I'm not the crunchiest mom on the block, but I think your pedi would be appalled by me, LOL.

I see no reason why you couldn't give your LO table food. My oldest DD we started solids at 4 months (per the pedi) and by 6 she was eating table food. My DS just started solids last week and two days later scarfed down a piece of garlic bread on his own. All three of my kids liked the flavors of "real" food much better than the jarred stuff. If it is gas, like someone mentioned, you could try doing gripe water or Mylicon afterward to help.

As far as the dairy, the only thing that I know of is that I think it is an allergy concern when given before a year. My DH was given milk early on (like at 6 months) and is now lactose intolerant.

As far as the sleeping, no help there. My kids were all in their own rooms by the time they were 6 weeks old and slept at least 8 hours by 6 months. But if the boy is hungry, I vote feed him!
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:31 AM   #7
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

What your going through is and can be very typical of that age. Especially boys....Growth spurts...

My sons even now at 2 and almost 4 still dont sleep through the night.
As far as the food goes the pediatrician is right in some ways that you may be feeding the wrong foods at the wrong time that can be upsetting for such a immature system.
Formula is definetly the next best thing after Breastmilk, but I would definetly maybe talk with a lactation consultant to see what you can do to up your supply.
Next what is your diet like? Are there any foods that can be bothering him.

The big things I would be feeding our veggies, fruit and cereal.

I would also suggest not feeding a meal right before bedtime becuase it can be very unsettling in the tummy when trying to get some sleep.

As far as the wake-ups during the night make them as boring as you possibly can. We also use white-noise a fan and we have a tape that is white noise. It really helps with keeping other unwanted noises out.

Good luck and hope you get a lot more advice, just remember they'll get it in time. Especially a lot of boys take there time in learning key development things.
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:34 AM   #8
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

The issue with cow's milk and soy milk is that the salt concentrations and protein concentrations are not similar enough to breast milk, so they stress the baby's kidneys. So that is why you have to use formula or breast milk until a year.
I always gave my kids quite a bit of table food at 9 months. I usually am completely off baby food and onto table food by that point, but it can be hard on their tummies. If it seems to be bothering him, cut it back. If not, keep going.
And, I know this is not a popular answer, but crying it out has always worked for us to solve sleep issues when nothing else would. We also shared a bedroom for a while with our baby, until we were able to build another bedroom. Our solution was to put a pack and play in the living room, office, or even the bathroom.
No easy solutions, I know. My 15 month old came back to bed with me this morning at 4 a.m., like always. At least lately he has been content just to cuddle, so I am not nursing him in the middle of the night anymore.
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:40 AM   #9
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

Our ds now sleeps, but we moved his crib from next to our bed, to our walk in closet. Now before you flame me, you need to realize the size of our closet. We could still walk past his crib to get out our bathroom! Anywhoo, we found that he slept better when he couldn't see us. (nothing to get excited aout when he woke up) We do our night time routine, bath, bootle, book, bed. And we cuddle a little bit, then off to bed, while he is drowsy. We let him cry (1 min per month old) if needed, otherwise we try to comfort while he is in his crib. Rub his back, put on a nice calm CD, offer his monkey, etc. We dont take him back out (unless warranted), talk to him, or turn on his light.
we tried co sleeping but we were both so afraid of killing him that he went back in his bed after one night.
Now he is in his own room and we also are only in his room of naps or bed! There are no toys in there, and everything (dresser, bookshelf) else he finds boring
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Old 10-10-2008, 07:41 AM   #10
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Re: Nobody can help me - and I think my ped is wrong

Everything you mentioned sounds normal...Exhausting, but, normal!! Some babies are higher maintenance than others! 9 months is a bid developmental growth stage. Growth spurts, teething, and other factors can impact their sleeping and eating habits.

As for the BF'ing....Peds are NOT the experts on this!!! BREASTS PRODUCE ENOUGH MILK FOR THE NEEDS OF YOU BABY!!! THE MORE YOU NURSE THE MORE THEY MAKE!!! I don't write that in caps to seem like I am yelling or being condescending, but, I do want folks to hear that!!! Your body works! And, it works well!! It may seem like you are "empty" but you're not. And, it may take a day or two to really feel full again as they catch up.

My DS did not sleep through the night until I night weaned at 18 mos. He too was up 2-3 hours to nurse and seemed like he really needed it. I think this time around I will night wean a bit earlier, maybe when DD is eating enough solids.

Good luck! Keep you sanity...This will pass so quickly!
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