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Old 05-27-2010, 09:37 PM   #11
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

FWIW, I have NEVER had anyone IRL label myself or themselves with any specific parenting parameters...so I guess it's never been an issue for me.

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Old 05-27-2010, 09:42 PM   #12
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

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Originally Posted by OperaDiva View Post
I agree that I wouldn't think you are AP if you CIO, the two just can't go together.

Spanking, on the other hand, kind of depends on your method. If you hit out of anger/frustration, that is not AP. If you use spanking in a controlled manner that includes explaining what was done wrong, why it was wrong, etc., it can definitely be part of AP if it works for your family.
That's interesting. I hadn't thought of it that way, but it makes sense. We don't spank out of anger. In fact, it really only gets to that point maybe a couple times a year. I can't remember the last time I spanked her, but we have in the past. Usually we do fine with different methods, like making her fix the problem she created somehow, or maybe doing a time-out (although time-outs don't work that well for her usually). It's only if she deliberately keeps doing the wrong thing, and just WON'T stop after many warnings, and being told that if it continues, she will get a spanking, that we spank her, then after she's had a few minutes to calm down and think, we talk about why it got to that point, and what she could do to avoid that in the future. I hate spanking, and until she was like 5, I always said I'd never do that, but sometimes it's just the only thing that seems to work. We try to do it in the least dictatorial way possible at least.
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Old 05-27-2010, 09:45 PM   #13
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

Generally when I think about AP, it is more of a answering that child's needs above your own kind of thing. Generally it is co-sleeping, baby wearing, breast feeding, and not CIO. The other things people tend to lump with AP I look more as a level of crunchiness. I am semi-crunchy, as I circ and spank. No, I do not spank out of anger and can count on my fingers the times my kids have been spanked, but I do. I did breast feed all of my children including my adopted son. I will not be able to BF our new baby because he is 6 months old and I do not have time to induce. I will wear him and feed him close though. I do vax selectively and VERY delayed. If my last baby and any babies to follow were not adopted, they wouldn't be vaxed at all. The courts require vaxxing of them to finalize adoption though, and they do allow delayed vaxxing.

I am rambling. I am sure many would say I am *not* AP'ing, though many who know me IRL think I am super crunchy. I think it is all in your perspective. I don't care where you label me...I do what I feel is best for my children and their health and development. I think that is what we all do, regardless of our label.
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Old 05-27-2010, 10:33 PM   #14
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

Hmmmmm, interesting. Let's see here. I would consider myself AP, but some people may not. I def. agree with a PP who said that it can mean different things to different people. I want my children to grow up in a secure and loving house where they can freely communicate and be able to trust. I never want my kids to feel scared or intimidated......so why would I, their mother EVER do that to them? Trust is extremely important to me and my older 2 know that they can completely trust me. I've never lied to them and I have never told them/promised them things I can't be true to. That includes the "simplist" yes we will go to the park after nap. If I say it...it will happen. If for some reason something comes up that I can not foresee, then I will explain it to them.

I absolutely do NOT believe in CIO. I try to do everything I possibly can to calm the crying, but if I'm at a loss then I will hold my crying baby in my arms and cry along with them. I would never just leave them to cry on their own. *shudder* I can't imagine.

I breastfeed, but only up to age 2. That is my personal limit. I did not bf my oldest dd longer than a month b/c I was having really bad latch issues and I didn't know to see a different/better LC or have knowledge of online support. I deeply regretted it not working out for the rest of her first year and I still have regret. I still wish I would have known of kellymom.com then. I thankfully found it through a friend with dd2 and I owe all of our and dd3's and now ds's bf'ing success to it.

I babywear. I had a bjorn with dd1 b/c again, at the time I didn't know of all the fabulous carriers out there. I have worn all the rest and they love it. When I stop wearing them out and about once the new babe comes along they LOVE being in the stroller b/c they hadn't hardly ever been in one before.

We cosleep, but only the first 3-5 months. Again....we did not with dd1 and oh the sleep I missed out on the first few months of her life! We put them in their own rooms in a crib b/c after the first 3-5 months they sleep MUCH better on their own. It is kind of like they still need to be close to me for the first few months after they are born, but then as they grow into the 4-5 month they start to not sleep as well. We put them in their own rooms and back to blissful night sleep. They all go to sleep easily. We do pj's, brush teeth, read a few stories, lay them in their beds, give hugs/kisses, say "good night, sleep tight....I love you..." and then close the door. Even Will goes to sleep on his own by just being layed in the crib. None of mine have ever nursed to sleep.

Now, we do have an open bed policy. Anyone is welcome in our bed at ANYtime. Anna probably crawls in bed next to me about 3-4 nights of the week. I have a bed rail set up on my side of the bed. Ella and Lily very occassionally come in. And, Will....if he wakes up and I don't want to nurse him in the recliner in his room then I will bring him into bed with dh and I. He usually nurses for 3 min. and is back to sleep so I just do it in the recliner.

I stay at home, but I do work out (exercise) 4-5 days a week and the kids go to the nursery at the gym. They love it. If they were really upset I wouldn't leave them. Although it depends on why they are upset and how long it lasts. I def. need that "me" time for working out. It is good for my body and my health and I feel so amazing after a great work out.

I go out without my kids! Yes, I love to run errand by myself and grab a Starbucks drink or a diet coke to enjoy while I do my errands. I LOVE going out to dinner with dh and actually get to have an uninterrupted conversation with him. I LOVE going to adult movies! I love going to the local bar to have a drink or two and chat with friends.

While I like to do what I posted in the above paragraph, I take my under a year nursling with me unless I will be home in less than 2 hours. We just started leaving Will with the babysitter last week at 10 months, although I did come home to nurse him between dinner and the movie.

I love my kids more than I can ever describe. I love being with them and I love the feeling of miss I have when I'm not with them and the amazing feel of excitement and happiness I feel when I get home to them.

The other extremely important thing to me and as a parent is DISCIPLINE. With that I mean TEACHING them the appropriate way to behave and teaching them good manners. They aren't born knowing everything, so as a parent it is my job to teach them. I do it in a positive way. We have inside voices and walking feet indoors. We ALWAYS say "please" and "thank you." We are considerate of other people's feelings. If someone asks us how we are or says hello, we answer them. If they want to have a conversation with us, and we don't really feel like talking we don't ignore them, we simply say "i'm sorry, but I really don't feel like talking much right now, I hope you can understand." Those are just a few examples.

I feel setting limits is very important also.

It really bothers me when kids have no manners. I have a friend whose children are lacking manners. I really dislike when I see her oldest (6) whom I've known really well for 3 years that will not say a word to me and give me a scowly look when I see her and ask how she is. It also really bothers me when I'm out and see kids running around unruley and very loud. And it cracks me up when the parent is oh so quietly telling them "shhhhh". Like they can even hear them!!!! And probably what bothers me the most is when parents can't bear to teach their toddler/child no. I don't mean no as in the word "no", but in the context.
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Old 05-27-2010, 10:35 PM   #15
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

You know, I wouldn't disagree with someone who called themselves AP. If they want that label, even if they're wrong about it, it doesn't affect me and I'm not going to make it my business to try and tell them they're not.

I know that my personal crunchy AP list would mean that I/others:
-do not circumcise (unless the family is Jewish and has a bris, or is Muslim)
-make a wholehearted attempt for natural birth (whether at home, with a doula, etc)
-research vaccines thoroughly. Even if they decide to vaccinate, the research needs to be done.
-ERF
-makes every attempt to nurse for at least a year
-no CIO
-no spanking
-co-sleep or room share

See though, most of those aren't do-or-die. If someone has a UP/UC, nurses until age 5, doesn't vaccinate, unschools, never spanks, protests circ at every opportunity but they have their baby in a crib in a separate room, who am I to tell them they're not AP? I can only hold those standards for myself. I will home birth, nurse 2+ years, cloth diaper, leave all kids intact, delay vaccines, raise my kids vegetarian, baby wear, co-sleep, all that good stuff. However, I certainly don't look crunchy and I'll pierce DD's ears as a baby, so does that one transgression void all my AP-ness? No. So I'm not going to try and label other people.
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Old 05-27-2010, 11:12 PM   #16
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

I probably shouldn't respond to this, but I'm going to anyway.
There have been people who have described me as AP. I honestly could care less if I fit into a category of parenting style, I just want to raise my kids with values and common sense.
For me, common sense includes:
Babywearing - it's just easier than lugging a carseat around or trying to maneuver a stroller and a walking two year old or a double stroller.
Breastfeeding- I don't think I need to explain that one.
Baby-led scheduling- scheduling babies doesn't work.
Spanking occasionally- sometimes my toddler is doing something dangerous or defiant, and no amout of explanation is helping him to see that he needs to find a different way.
CIO occasionally- with my oldest, it was a way of coping with PPD, among other things. There were times that I had to let him cry because I didn't trust myself. Now, it's because my kids get overstimulated if I try to "help" them go to sleep. Rocking, nursing, cosleeping just simply don't work with my kids. Going through a bedtime routine and laying them in bed in their dark rooms does. Sometimes they cry. It is not because their needs haven't been met. It's because their wants haven't been met. I would rather let them cry for five or ten minutes than lose sleep or cry for an hour in my arms.
Then again, people say that isn't CIO. I think it is the definition of CIO.
Personally, I thing labels are for people who are insecure about their parenting and need to make themselves feel better with a label of some sort. Then again, I feel the same way about political parties and legislators.
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Old 05-28-2010, 12:02 AM   #17
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

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The definition can vary so wildly depending on who you are talking to that the term itself doesn't mean a whole lot to me, to be perfectly honest. It's just a label, people throw it around just like the whole "ecofriendly" thing. People can go to Walmart and pick up a bottle of Clorox GreenWorks dish soap and call themselves ecofriendly. If I use the AP term at all, I do so very loosely...because even though I cosleep, babywear, don't spank, don't do CIO, there are some things I do (leave my kids with the inlaws or a sitter, do not EBF) that probably raises eyebrows.
ITA. Everyone's definitions of things are different just based on varying perceptions.

I would ASSUME that AP'ers don't dry it out, babywear, feed on demand, cosleep, have child-led families ETC but when it really comes down to it their version of AP may vary from what I consider AP...and FWIW I don't know much AP (the true defined in books form). Everything I know would come from people who have claimed to be AP.

Its not something *I* personally believe in or practice (based on what I've gathered about it from other people) so I have never looked further into it than what others have told me.
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Old 05-28-2010, 06:37 AM   #18
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

I think you would have to do pretty much all the 7 baby b's to be considered an AP parent IMO with the exception of baby wearing. I prefer to just hold my babies in my arms or on my hip and just b/c I don't have a carrier on doesn't mean I'm less in tune with my baby I would also add no-circing unless for necessary medical issues.

I think some people blur the lines of AP and NFL although many do both or definitely overlap.
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Old 05-28-2010, 07:27 AM   #19
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

See this is why labels like this irritate me. It really means very little since people interrupt it in many ways. Probably some people think I am AP and others would never think that. I really don't care to use any type of label like that. You can be very in tune with your child even if you don't follow some of the Bs or other AP principles. It's a good start if you don't know what to do but it's not the end all.
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Old 05-28-2010, 07:32 AM   #20
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Re: When would not consider someone AP'ing?

Also I wanted to say - to a lot of people IRL, I am "super AP" because a lot of things I do are not the norm around here (CDing, BWing, cosleeping, non-circing, etc). But on this board, I am probably way more mainstream. It depends on your company, too!
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